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View Full Version : Say "NO" to Macro Fuhrers! (EvilAngel PeroGambit Blockade)



Vic47
12-06-2015, 12:27 PM
So, continuing this thread http://harem-battle.club/peropero-seduction/335-vote-ban-ea-2.html , since it's closed, and since EA didn't stop using macro's to steal all the pink cases during PeroGambit Events right after people spawn them, i hereby join the "no EA on the list" club, and starting to remove players who have him on their Friend List in PeroPero Seduction. No offence, guys, i just don't want to support cheating on other players and support fair gameplay. I might also add you all back after this, and further PeroGambit Event(s) will end if you PM me with a pie or something.
Right now i've cleaned my Friend List from all who feed their cases to The Macro Fuhrer, and have 12 free Friend Slots at the moment - feel free to join in. (My Pero ID is 1058358 )
Also, post here the nicknames/Pero IDs of other Macro Fuhrers and cheaters if you know them.

Massume
12-06-2015, 03:02 PM
Well I dont think that it is a wise decision to start calling players ''macro-users'' on this forum without any concrete evidence. I must say that I have certainly noticed suspicious behaviour of some players on my friendlist, but that is not enough in my opinion to start calling them a cheater or making a blockade or whatever.

Second of all, although macro-users are the cause of the problem, let us not forget that Nutaku is responsible for taking care of any rulebreakers. Frankly speaking, I doubt that Nutaku even has the time/money to track down these players nor do they have the technology to find them. So rather than starting a witch hunt, I think that it is problably better to figure out a way that makes these macros useless. For the ''Gambit and the pink boxes issue'', it might be an idea to start putting a cooldown time or a restriction on the pink boxes. That way macros will be less usefull and other players will have a decent chance to open them.

But just to be clear, I am against macro's aswell, but I dont think that blocking people in the game is going to solve this issue.

Though this is just my opinion on this matter.:cool:

chillinfar
12-06-2015, 03:40 PM
A little closure about that behavior was explained on the mentioned thread. And isn't hard to see, try to pick a pink box in the shortest time possible, you will notice a delay. In my case, the shortest time is 2.8s, but could be a bit faster (2.4-2.5s) if delay couldn't bad in my land

And as i said before, EvilAngel is not the only macro guy in the game, some whales are doing the same and i suspect that's why Nutaku isn't banning anyone despite it violates ToS.

P.S: and as i warned before, perogambit is when friendship ends.

Vic47
12-06-2015, 07:21 PM
Well I dont think that it is a wise decision to start calling players ''macro-users'' on this forum without any concrete evidence. I must say that I have certainly noticed suspicious behaviour of some players on my friendlist, but that is not enough in my opinion to start calling them a cheater or making a blockade or whatever.

Second of all, although macro-users are the cause of the problem, let us not forget that Nutaku is responsible for taking care of any rulebreakers. Frankly speaking, I doubt that Nutaku even has the time/money to track down these players nor do they have the technology to find them. So rather than starting a witch hunt, I think that it is problably better to figure out a way that makes these macros useless. For the ''Gambit and the pink boxes issue'', it might be an idea to start putting a cooldown time or a restriction on the pink boxes. That way macros will be less usefull and other players will have a decent chance to open them.

But just to be clear, I am against macro's aswell, but I dont think that blocking people in the game is going to solve this issue.

Though this is just my opinion on this matter.:cool:

It is more than obvious. No one can stay online 24/7 and open all the boxes right after they spawn. For that you must become a bot yourself and sit infront of your PC all day long, blindly clicking just tow buttons every second to get all the boxes that spawn ASAP. Even a maniacal gamer like me won't stand doing that for long. I can hardly manage to do a "get 1 SR card" daily quest while rolling the N Gacha 50 imes in a row, so it is 100% macro, not human. I'm not against cheating on the game devs, or, even, piracy, when it comes to insane prices, bad user support and overall treatment ("scamtaku" didn't got this nickname for nothing) or anything, until it hurts other players. But i'm clearly against any kind of cheating that hurts other players or ruinst their gameplay.
I am not in a very friendly relationships with most of the other players to actually call them my Friends, so i don't care much, except for, probably, some, with which i do speak from time to time, who i personally like, or who i am thankful to (like Tomaa and Kotono, who keep updating the Wiki and other things on this website) Still, i'm here to play the game, and if someone ruins my gameplay - i will do anything to get rid of the troublemaker. Especially, when one is a complete stranger to me. There are alot of other players to team-up with, you know, and even among the "whales" there are alot of those who don't have him on their list. More than that, the only major help i get from "whales" is slaying SEGs during SEG events, (which is, first of all, to _their_ benefit, not mine, due to _they_ get all EP and points for killing them, and i only get the elimination counts.) and i can't recall EA helping me there (except, maybe, when i was a total noob and shared even lvl 1 EGs, who he, probably, oneshotted, technically, just stealing EP i could earn myself if i knew i could not share them at all)
And i don't really mind if the other guys use macro's to pop up the boxes, or whatever else, until they don't do it 24/7 and don't ruin my gameplay. I mean, Nutaku is selling keys 1,5k Pero each, but i just keep on stacking them (over 700 already) just because i need Ngacha tickets, and the number isn't reducing as it should - it just grows, becaue EA steals all the boxes and i have nothing to use those keys for.
I mean, that was so, for the last Gambit and until today. Today i removed everyone who had him on the list and the keys finally came in handy. Also, got a bunch of new teammates 1mil SED+ I'm not calling everyone cheaters for no reason, or to totally ban or blockade EA or others (if any) like him, but it is your choice. If someone plays dirty against me - there is no reasonfor me to help them, or suffer from their cheating. But i do know i'm not the only one who is offended by this behaviour, and created this thread to stop the macro-abuse on players, and to help those who will decide to do the same thing that i did (and Previously done by Julia) to refill their list faster, if they'll chose to make a "cleanup" and find new box-spawning friends (with boxes that will actually _last_ more than a second so it's a fair chance for everyone to find and open them). And i'm pretty sure EA can always go and buy whatever he wants for Gold anyway, while for the f2p players evenst are almost the only way to get resources they need.

- - - Updated - - -


perogambit is when friendship ends.

Perogambit is not "when the friendship ends". It is when friends open boxes for each other, and share their boxes with each other, instead of bringing them to the althar of a greedy cheater who treat his friends like milking cattle.

nip101
12-07-2015, 12:53 AM
Sadly EA isn't the only one doing this and it seems like its mostly big spenders who are boting for this stuff, I'm friends with another person whose top 10 in most events and hes opened all but maybe 2 of my pink boxes. Luckily I have enough friends that i can still use 50-100 keys a day but they must be using several hundred a day. Also chillin is right that they wont do anything to stop it because its the whales doing it.

chillinfar
12-07-2015, 01:50 AM
Perogambit is not "when the friendship ends". It is when friends open boxes for each other, and share their boxes with each other, instead of bringing them to the althar of a greedy cheater who treat his friends like milking cattle.

Unless you got a lot of fast friends, or a 24/7 guy... or a lot of them (FYI, Nutaku ToS tolerate the sharing of accounts; funny fact, but while it means more cash from interested users of that account they aren't worried).

Armeris
12-07-2015, 04:57 AM
Vic47, just out of curiosity, what if one of your "real friends" was a friend of EA? Would you be so hypocritical as to eat your words and keep your friends list? Or do you keep your word?

Watching your comments the Christian inquisition and all fascist governments get their approval.

Since this is so personal, I suggest you to take legal action, you know, a complaint to the company, by allowing the use of macros to the rich, and the person who uses them for breaking the law.

khermeker
12-07-2015, 08:37 AM
Vic47, just out of curiosity, what if one of your "real friends" was a friend of EA? Would you be so hypocritical as to eat your words and keep your friends list? Or do you keep your word?

Watching your comments the Christian inquisition and all fascist governments get their approval.

Since this is so personal, I suggest you to take legal action, you know, a complaint to the company, by allowing the use of macros to the rich, and the person who uses them for breaking the law.

ok i have to agree with that....i dont have macro friends (im sure of it, no box open before 2 secs and sometimes see ones stay for 5 mins+) still dont know my friends is impossible just spot when pink keys appear still i had open some...

but what bug me is the sr card in case....that is insane rare and kinda unfair...the 50k stamps...well dont know i think i can do it but i will not be sure anytime soon...im waiting for second part for use my stamina refills (have 15 full and 35 half) all my radars (now 60) and have 8k stamps.....after start next part and get the second cheap boost i will start use all my radars i hope get 12k-13k in first part and with luck the rest in second part using stamina a lot of stamina.

DragonSR
12-07-2015, 11:55 AM
I gotta agree with the Macro problem. At least its only for this Event and not others.

Vic47
12-07-2015, 01:45 PM
Vic47, just out of curiosity, what if one of your "real friends" was a friend of EA? Would you be so hypocritical as to eat your words and keep your friends list? Or do you keep your word?

Watching your comments the Christian inquisition and all fascist governments get their approval.

Since this is so personal, I suggest you to take legal action, you know, a complaint to the company, by allowing the use of macros to the rich, and the person who uses them for breaking the law.

So you know, i even removed Kotono for this reason, while i am really thankful to him for his great job on this forum and the Wiki i use alot, and Julia removed me before for the same reason, while we do have a chitchat from time to time, so i, probably, can consider him my Friend. (Though, Julia backpedalled here, as you can read in his thread, because he considers EA his real Friend, so i might remove him later as well, if he will re-add EA later - and he is AFK for 9 days already in PPS, anyway)

No hipocricy here, no double standarts. And anyway, this is just a game. As i said before - no offence. The fact i am removing someone from a friend list on a given game doesn't mean i will quit speaking with you on the forums or anything else, just because you have someone i don't like on your Friend List in some game. But i do dislike people who ruin another people's joy from games or otherwise bully them and that will never change.

Also, just so you know - _you_ are still on my list just because you've changed your leading card. I don't like futa alot, so i was planning to remove you from the list long time ago because of that. Good thing my friend list expanded so i got alot of other friends to tag with pies from both sides of your position and you've changed your leading card, so i don't have to look at this dickgirl every day. Not that i have something positive or negative about you on my mind, i just don't like dickgirls. And i don't want something i don't like in games or other places i come to relax, have fun and enjoy.
And i will sure clear my mind about EA's cheating if he'll stop doing that. But, as far they (macro cheaters) don't care about us, i'm not going to care about them, and help them thrive. they can just buy whatever they need, after all, while f2p players already are getting alot less than they are just because of the Scamtaku policy.
And about the "legal action" blah-blah, i've sent alot of Support Tickets to Nutaku about the "maco problem" but they never replied - probably, because of _their_ hipocricy on some of the "whales" violating their ToS, just because it is just a big a "cash grab machine", and they don't really care, for what people will pay them, until they pay. As someone mentioned before on this forum, hosters of games like PPS, like Nutaku, get most of their cash from 0.001% of the players or something... so they will never change anything towards the other 99+% until they get their cash from those few big spenders.
A've also sent alot of Tickets about other problems to them, but never got any single reply and ingame changes, except that they told me that they'll ban some asshat who was abusing me and other layers with mouthy pie messages, but they never banned him anyway, or didn't even removed his swearings and insults from our Pie Message Lists, and once they've fixed a Daili Flirting Mission description, that stated you should get "3 R cards" or something to get "Wild Card" while it was actually "Get 3 SR cards" to get "1 EX Wild Card" (but they still haven't changd the reward description) and they fixed "Wild Card" prize info on "Get 1 SR Card" to "SR Wild Card" that i asked them to do in teh same Support Ticket, but that's all. So i doubt that "legal actions" will have any effect, no matter how many times i, or other F2Ps will try.
I can also tell you a story about a "riot" donators once started on VK.com about PlayFlock's game "Madness" when PlayFlock messed up the gameplay with another update, and the top spenders decided to stop donating until the update would be removed from the game, and the result was that PlayFlock just banned the accounts of all who subscribed to the "Riot" community page on VK, both donators and f2p, both in the game and on their community page on VK, so i doubt "legal actions" worth anything in case of Scamtaku aswell. It's just the players who must somehow deal with their problems, and that's it.

chillinfar
12-07-2015, 01:50 PM
I found the previous Julia's thread healthier than this.

P.S: If that was true, Nutaku should did it at 2nd Elite Guard or 3rd perocolo.

Tomaa
12-08-2015, 01:54 AM
Do not bother reporting any of this stuff.
This whole thing is based on pure speculation and is inflated to the point it is easy to prove wrong and it will not be taken seriously, specially by a company.
Also keep in mind that sharing accounts, multiboxing or even using ingame macro's is not against their ToS.

That being said, if you dont like someone or feel like someone is impairing your ability to play or enjoy the game, remove or block them. That is perfectly fine.
Just try to be civil about it and present your opinion calmly and rationally if you want to be taken seriously.

chillinfar
12-08-2015, 11:08 AM
You're wrong in only one point, macros are against ToS, see point 3 (User Conduct)


use any robot, spider, scraper, or other automated means to access the Website for any purpose;

Vic47
12-08-2015, 12:43 PM
using ingame macro's

WHAT?? Are you saying macro's are pre-installed in the game itself by the devs, and they are not a side software executed, like auto mouse clicker or something???
Well, then, and if it's not something against their ToS, i'd like to know a macro to roll the goddamn Ngacha on it's own, bacause i hate spending time on rolling it for like 50 times every day, sinche there is no "roll x10" button here like it is in LoV, for example, and getting those SR cards from it is a brainer... =_=" (this will also not impair anything, so i don't count this as "cheating" against anyone)
Also, what is "multiboxing"? I've never herad such a term before...

Tomaa
12-08-2015, 01:11 PM
You're wrong in only one point, macros are against ToS, see point 3 (User Conduct)
thats not what it means


WHAT?? Are you saying macro's are pre-installed in the game itself by the devs, and they are not a side software executed, like auto mouse clicker or something???
Well, then, and if it's not something against their ToS, i'd like to know a macro to roll the goddamn Ngacha on it's own, bacause i hate spending time on rolling it for like 50 times every day, sinche there is no "roll x10" button here like it is in LoV, for example, and getting those SR cards from it is a brainer... =_=" (this will also not impair anything, so i don't count this as "cheating" against anyone)
Also, what is "multiboxing"? I've never herad such a term before...
multiboxing is playing on 2 separate accounts at the same time

Tenhou
12-08-2015, 03:50 PM
The automated thingie does not necessarily mean macros or clickbots. It means a program that understands the game and sends the game commands for you. A clickbot only repeats a click you already did, that is why Tomaa suggests it is not against the ToS. It's not automating the GAME it's automating the COMPUTER and thus does not cause any changes in the game. An opposite form of this would be to make a program that understands the games commands and gives the games commands on its own. A clickbot does not understand anything, it just repeats something you already did to infinity.

At least that's what i've understood. Don't sue if i'm wrong :P

Tomaa
12-08-2015, 04:46 PM
The automated thingie does not necessarily mean macros or clickbots. It means a program that understands the game and sends the game commands for you. A clickbot only repeats a click you already did, that is why Tomaa suggests it is not against the ToS. It's not automating the GAME it's automating the COMPUTER and thus does not cause any changes in the game. An opposite form of this would be to make a program that understands the games commands and gives the games commands on its own. A clickbot does not understand anything, it just repeats something you already did to infinity.

At least that's what i've understood. Don't sue if i'm wrong :P
What you have in mind is called a bot. That is not covered by their ToS as well, but I never even heard about such bot.
Macro itself is an automated action, but its not accessing the website itself.
What that line refers to is web server access using automated tasks like crawling, bruteforcing, etc. It is standard line in ToS and its purpose is mainly to prevent unintentional DDoS and to stop people poking around out of curiosity.

That being said, I dont endorse using macros. ToS can change any time, and in theory, they can ban anyone for any reason.

Massume
12-08-2015, 05:43 PM
I must admit that I actually thought that they were referring to macros when someone qouted that line on this forum, but your explanations makes a lot of sense.
Besides, it seems very unlikely that Nutaku would bother to hire a person just to track down a few macro users, while only a few hunderd players are actually spending money on this game.

Well I am not a computer genius at all, so you guys wont have to worry that I will start using a program like that in the future ;)

Overload
12-08-2015, 06:23 PM
Well what that paragraph means, is a program that itself makes/forces access to the game code to get info/to change parameters that normal players shouldn't have access to.
A clickbot doesn't do that, it's just recorded the clicks of the mouse and repeats them that means it doesn't affect the game code at all and as such doesn't go against the rules.
Yeah it's not nice, but such things are in most games not covered, because there is no possible way for a developer/publisher to prove sth like that if it doesn't affect the game code directly.

nip101
12-08-2015, 06:42 PM
How is a an autoclicker not an automated means of accessing the site?

Edit:
Also it Doesn't matter anyways because the people who are cheating have spent thousands on their accounts and Nutaku wont ban those people. Pretty sure nothing happened to the people who cheated on the first coliseum event.

Tenhou
12-08-2015, 07:13 PM
How is a an autoclicker not an automated means of accessing the site?


Because they mean access as in gaining access to the code structures of the game and site. They mean an automated process that KNOWS how to handle game messages. It knows it shall access the case menu and then search for gambit cases. If there are any it will automatically open them. Basically it digs deep into game data to know what it must do.

In contrast a clickbot, while automated, does not "access" the site/game, it just clicks places on the screen, much as if you had just set some contraption on top of your mouse to spam the left key. It is an "outside" process meaning it does not gain access to game data, it simply clicks a place on the screen and is none the wiser of what it does, it just repeats a process without modifying game data. This is then used to click in the very specific locations where the buttons are, but it is still done with the very same process as if you would have clicked the button yourself, therefor it does not "access" the game.

To be even more specific: A computer has commands for what happens when you press the left mousebutton. It then tells that something has been pressed on that part of the screen, that is all. The clickbot just tells the computer the very same thing that a mouse click would have done. The type of program that nutaku dislikes instead bypasses this completely by accessing the actual game and telling the game "go to this menu, do this thing" rather than telling the computer "this place was clicked, act on it."

chillinfar
12-08-2015, 07:27 PM
The automated thingie does not necessarily mean macros or clickbots. It means a program that understands the game and sends the game commands for you. A clickbot only repeats a click you already did, that is why Tomaa suggests it is not against the ToS. It's not automating the GAME it's automating the COMPUTER and thus does not cause any changes in the game. An opposite form of this would be to make a program that understands the games commands and gives the games commands on its own. A clickbot does not understand anything, it just repeats something you already did to infinity.

At least that's what i've understood. Don't sue if i'm wrong :P


What you have in mind is called a bot. That is not covered by their ToS as well, but I never even heard about such bot.
Macro itself is an automated action, but its not accessing the website itself.
What that line refers to is web server access using automated tasks like crawling, bruteforcing, etc. It is standard line in ToS and its purpose is mainly to prevent unintentional DDoS and to stop people poking around out of curiosity.

That being said, I dont endorse using macros. ToS can change any time, and in theory, they can ban anyone for any reason.


I must admit that I actually thought that they were referring to macros when someone qouted that line on this forum, but your explanations makes a lot of sense.
Besides, it seems very unlikely that Nutaku would bother to hire a person just to track down a few macro users, while only a few hunderd players are actually spending money on this game.

Well I am not a computer genius at all, so you guys wont have to worry that I will start using a program like that in the future ;)

I highlighted that part of the ToS because is generic, when they said "or other automated means to access the Website for any purpose" it means any automated action over the site, even if you don't alter some code.

A DDoS attack by example, can be provoked using one feature of the victim site at great scale; you don't even need a "l33t h4xx0r" to provoke it, just a huge amount of coordinated people abusing of the same task, no coding involved. i.e the 4chan vs Tumblr pic war (http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/4chumblr), specially how Tumblr users reacted against /b/ wankers.

A mouse macro works with the same idea at very little scale. Yes, the mimic is realized at local level, but not the data sent everytime that you use any Nutaku app.

And how staff can see (using logs) if a user is automating some actions? Easy, if logs has timestamps these can bring a clue, even with Wireshark or MS Network monitor i can test it (limited to my own side). I can see the Nutaku ID inside the URL executing some of them, so is possible to identify some behavior.

As i said before, a delay between boxes (picking it manually) already exists, that's why those moves looks suspicious.

Unregistered
12-09-2015, 02:14 PM
can someone give me a plausible scenario for a "macro" to open pink boxes ?? i mean the scenario it would follow

SumTingRong
12-09-2015, 02:22 PM
can someone give me a plausible scenario for a "macro" to open pink boxes ?? i mean the scenario it would follow
k i made an account :) better this way.
@chillinfar
so you are saying the guy setup a clicker on different intervals and areas on the screen to refresh/open pink boxes ?

chillinfar
12-09-2015, 03:33 PM
is possible

Vic47
12-09-2015, 06:55 PM
multiboxing is playing on 2 separate accounts at the same time
Oh, thanks. We call them "multiacc(ount)"s or "twink"s in Russian. And i've also heard a term "smurf" for the second an other, smaller-level accounts here, i believe...

- - - Updated - - -

Well, ok, i've read this therad since i last was here, but, since i had no sleep for like 25h+ i've lost who said what, wbut here is my asnwerz...
1) I've already told you how how once ended a donators "riot" on similiar game on VK - the admins just banned several hundred accounts without even checking if they were donation, cheating, botting or anything. They just did that and cared shit. Sure there were much more donating players on that game than PPS has, but the iot-starters were, mostly, from a top-donator's elite clan - a bunch of rich people who spend thoulsands of bucks on most PPS-like games on VK just to be "a top VK gaming clan in all games" on al the scoreboards. So it was a goddamn solid piece of that company's income. and they still didn't cared.
2) The clickbots. First, they actually interact with the game with their automated behaviour. And even while modern clickers have alot of randomizers (like clicking only inside the slected areas to not miss the buttons but always click different pixels of them (coordinates on the screen), randomizers for +XX pixels to the last click on random direction, and +/-random seconds to the time delay between the steps of your script and click repeeats, and even install a separate set of "kb/mouse" drivers to actually imitate phisical HID devices on the system, they still are getting tracked, by those timestamps, clicking "heat maps" (logging the coordinates of ALL your clicks and learning and finding your "human" and your "clickbot" clicking behaviour patterns) they still get caught. The very same "Madness" games required you to punch those Elite Guard equivalents in the face hundreds of times in a sequence with your weapon, so people tried automating that - and get banned in a matter of days.
Still, i have to admit, that i've tried and used some self-made scripted patterns using few clickbots known to me, to roll the bloody Ngacha for SR cards daily mission a few times, and i'm still playing, but i quickly noticed, that when _I_ play, i playe really different than my best Clicker Script (i make alot of mistakes, often click multiple times before the came can actually accept my click and go to teh next step, use much more different time delays between clicks on different roll stages, etc, so it is bloody easy to feel the difference when it is me and when it is the clicker software that rolls the gacha. So i could get caught really quick if they really do track down clickbotters, etc. I don't know, was i to quick to stop that, or don't they actually care, or is it not violating their ToS as they meant it (maybe they really only against the stuff that messes up with the game's code directly and might casue DDOS', lag, crash, cheating, account theft etc. and clickbots are considered "OK") or thet they just close their eyes on EA and other "Whales" cheating just because they pay alot or whatever (also, remember all those lags, error/crashes/otehr problems on SEG events? Could these be because some of the "whales" (or not) really messed up with the game's code directly with some cheats?
Oh, and i also forgot those session interrupts that happen all the time, and popping up windows requiring you to press "ok" and then manually updte your gam epage to continue playing? Them, and those random events called 'step-up animations" also break down your sweet Clicker Soft scripted pattern, or make you add an nunneeded action to teh script, that will prove you are using a bot, because you click several extra times to try to skip those Step-ups, while there are no step-ups most pf the time... (this is not the problem on opening gambit ases, though,as there no Step-Up and onther changing things, mostly, but the clicker will just try and "poen cases" when there are no cases to open, giving itself out...)
So, well, if someone wants to check out Nutaku's clickbot detection system and theyr toleracne to such behaviour, i can teach you that (i suppose that would be our Admins - Tmoaa or Kotono, who i trust the most, or a person they will consider trustworthy enough to test it, to not use the soft i'll give them to cheat on other players like EA does. (of course this should be done on a brand new account, probably proxied, to hide it's creator's and user's IP or something, too, or on someone's "dropped for good", but previously donate-infused acc, to also test the tolerance on donators' accs, to find out, if Nutaku don't care of clickbots for all, or only for the big spenders) Still, it is very easily tracked, so i warn you not to try it on your own account untill it will get proved to be ban-safe. Or we can just forget what i've just said and leave things as the yare now, playing as we always do =)

ugh, i need some sleep now... Peace ^_^; V