Thread: The Problem with Harem Hero Events - And A Potential Solution

First off, I like how you think out of the box and try to make it possible for new players to get the older event girls (though you forget the Halloween event, even though that event was in a different format :P)

Personally I don't like the idea of the black market and the tickets. Right now it punishes old paying players for having paid for the girls.
And to be honest, you don't want to make paying players feel that they are punished.

However, I wasn't a big fan of the anniversary event. I think everybody has a couple of favourite event girls out there, that they couldn't get, yet it was highly unlikely to get the girl(s) you actually wanted with all of them in there.

I like the event booster tickets though. During an anniversary like event, I'd like it if I could get some kind of booster for a certain event so that when I spin the pachinko, I have a bigger chance on the girls from that event (still RNG, but at least you increase the odds).

Originally Posted by NinjaW

Could you provide any proof that no one wants the event idol and only two girls? Or are you projecting your interests onto the entire player base?

The event idol isn't the popular girl anyways and it's usually the troll drops/Epic Pachinko drops that players would want in the first place. L2R

People are NOT happy with the current format though. I'm sure that many would rather just ignore pachinko-only girls instead of shelling out the prices currently being asked for. And while we understand that RNG is a harsh mistress and sometimes the luck just isn't with you, it still stings when you get a bad streak.

"Some" free players aren't happy with the current format. If you're playing enough, you will almost certainly get the event girls. It takes work to get some things in life.

I don't know about that. I consider them to be the saving grace of the event format. The very first event didn't have that yet and it was only the troll drops and the pachinko drops. It was kind of nice in the events after that where you know that you've got at least one girl guaranteed no matter what happens with the RNG.

Isn't the popular girl =/= no guaranteed event girl

DrQuatsch - I suggested to Jessie a booster that could be purchased for Kobans that would increase the drop rate of event girls by a bit for the duration of the event. Your idea works too!

The F2P posts here remind me of other F2P posts in games. There's always the crowd of free players that "suggest" ideas that would essentially give them whatever they want (the premium content), without having to spend money. It's a thinly veiled suggestion. Just be upfront about it and say, hey, I don't want to spend much money, but I want all the awesome premium content that everyone else has to pay for.

OP basically deflected on the key points that I mentioned.

God forbid I have criticisms of a game.

I think Greetingz wants you to offer constructive criticism of the game, not basically you saying that you want to have a way to obtain premium content without having to spend the money.

Please don't feed the trolls

Given building the Harem is 'the game' and there is no end game content being able to channel energy into any kind of farming would be nice too.

And the idea of perma locked content doesn't sit well with me either, yes the dev can open the vault whenever they like but a more structured way would be appreciated - I'd rather not have everything koban locked - and hopefully part of the rethink will vist the cost/koban ratio

Perhaps after a time, or once a world is farmed out the bosses could drop tokens, and these tokens in time could be traded for old event girls....so say you wanted event girl X, boss Y drops the tokens, you need to farm all 3 girls then say 3 tokens....as rare as a girl drop...to get 1 girl

LOT of work, but end game....

They could just do re-issue events and/or perma re-issue events like FKG does. Those don't hurt old players, nor they hurt whales. They actually help all players including whales to get content they missed, and having just re-issues on the side of main events doesn't hurt whales who got everything before. As long as you don't think letting new people get old content hurts old players cause the had stuff you don't just cause they got into game faster.

Hek - it could actually bring more revenue for devs. We have so much events, that F2P cant really spin 900 kobans pachinko for girl each event, add the fact that there is more than 1 girl and that you need luck to get event girls (if you didn't farm all troll normal girls before-hand), and you end up with situation where its actually harder for F2P people to get premium content girls, which could force more of them to go whales and buy kobans to spin more times. Just having re-issue events side-to-side with normal events could force some "stamina" refilling for having more chances to get event girls from trolls (for new people mostly).

Thats just my idea of solving this "old content not available anymore" problem. Thou personally I find HH premium content to be to damn expensive for me to even care about it, but it would let me get F2P stuff I possibly missed.

We're ALL "free" players in this. There's no subscription service. It's entirely voluntary if and when we choose to support the devs a bit with a purchase. An argument could be made though that more people might feel like paying and/or people might feel like paying more often if the prices were lower...

Regardless, those who would prefer not to pay do know that there's a selection of content that they just won't be getting. (At least not often. There are some free kobans that we can chase after and slowly save up.) The devs will handle that portion of the game in whatever way they feel makes the most business sense for them, we'll grumble about it a bit because it doesn't look too good from our end, but ultimately many of us will mostly ignore that portion of the game since it would be too absurd to be a completionist about it.

Ideas are thrown around, offered up for the devs' consideration, trying to smooth over the RNG of the standard portion of the game. The part that doesn't require kobans, just time. Random is random, of course. If the odds of something are 1 out of 100, in theory it should take around 100 rolls to get it but you'll have some players getting it at roll number 97 or 103 or 85 or 125 or 21 or 842 or whatever. The majority should fall closer to 100, but there will be outliers.

Anyway, I don't know what the chances are for girls to drop. I think I saw a post saying around 1 in 300? But sometimes you get on the low end of the curve and amazing luck delivers to you one or perhaps even both event drops (plus maybe even a non-event drop) all within the first day or two of the event, and sometimes you get on the high end of the curve and abysmal luck sees you trying dozens upon dozens of times every single day through the entire run of the event without any drops at all. And it is extremely frustrating when you're on that high end of the curve.

It is for those rougher streaks of bad luck that people propose ideas like "pity counters" to alter the chances after multiple failed attempts or "event token" drops to collect with better drop chances than the instant-win drop but needing to save up a bunch of them before you can use those to purchase that drop. Ideally the balance on such an idea would be that it will not take much longer to get the drop from this "shortcut" than it ought to take for an average case of lucking out on the instant-win drop right around the expected number of attempts. (Perhaps even aiming for a balance where you could realistically only expect to earn enough tokens for one of the two that you're trying to get from the bosses, still relying on luck to instant-win the other one.) A case of better luck on getting the girl to drop will see that result before the alternative can be used. The alternative would exist for the case where someone just isn't having that kind of luck.

Now this topic's original post does try suggest a way to revamp all aspects of the game into a more unified bigger picture, meaning that it is tinkering with both the "premium" and the "standard".... I think? Wait, no, he specifically said that some girls would continue to be pachinko exclusive (but they'd always be possible drops and they'd just be much more likely to drop from the pachinko during their event than they are outside of it) and the "black market" selection would be limited to the event girls who are NOT designated as pachinko exclusives. So the divide between "premium" content and "standard" content is still there.

Anyway, since the idea suggested a token reward/drop which would also be possible to pay kobans for, the balance of all the costs and drop rates of such a plan would be subject to heavy scrutiny by the devs if they consider it. They might have their own ideas about how much things should cost and how hard it should be to save up the tokens to buy something, as well as whether or not they'd agree with the topic creator's idea to draw a line where event variations of existing girls would be pachinko exclusive and only the brand new girls would appear in the black market (maybe the devs would want it the other way around as thanks for those who do buy kobans).

I'm pretty sure the topic creator gets that his values are examples and up for debate, that they're not an absolute final word on what should be used.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

We're ALL "free" players in this. There's no subscription service. It's entirely voluntary if and when we choose to support the devs a bit with a purchase. An argument could be made though that more people might feel like paying and/or people might feel like paying more often if the prices were lower...

Regardless, those who would prefer not to pay do know that there's a selection of content that they just won't be getting. (At least not often. There are some free kobans that we can chase after and slowly save up.) The devs will handle that portion of the game in whatever way they feel makes the most business sense for them, we'll grumble about it a bit because it doesn't look too good from our end, but ultimately many of us will mostly ignore that portion of the game since it would be too absurd to be a completionist about it.

Ideas are thrown around, offered up for the devs' consideration, trying to smooth over the RNG of the standard portion of the game. The part that doesn't require kobans, just time. Random is random, of course. If the odds of something are 1 out of 100, in theory it should take around 100 rolls to get it but you'll have some players getting it at roll number 97 or 103 or 85 or 125 or 21 or 842 or whatever. The majority should fall closer to 100, but there will be outliers.

Anyway, I don't know what the chances are for girls to drop. I think I saw a post saying around 1 in 300? But sometimes you get on the low end of the curve and amazing luck delivers to you one or perhaps even both event drops (plus maybe even a non-event drop) all within the first day or two of the event, and sometimes you get on the high end of the curve and abysmal luck sees you trying dozens upon dozens of times every single day through the entire run of the event without any drops at all. And it is extremely frustrating when you're on that high end of the curve.

It is for those rougher streaks of bad luck that people propose ideas like "pity counters" to alter the chances after multiple failed attempts or "event token" drops to collect with better drop chances than the instant-win drop but needing to save up a bunch of them before you can use those to purchase that drop. Ideally the balance on such an idea would be that it will not take much longer to get the drop from this "shortcut" than it ought to take for an average case of lucking out on the instant-win drop right around the expected number of attempts. (Perhaps even aiming for a balance where you could realistically only expect to earn enough tokens for one of the two that you're trying to get from the bosses, still relying on luck to instant-win the other one.) A case of better luck on getting the girl to drop will see that result before the alternative can be used. The alternative would exist for the case where someone just isn't having that kind of luck.

Now this topic's original post does try suggest a way to revamp all aspects of the game into a more unified bigger picture, meaning that it is tinkering with both the "premium" and the "standard".... I think? Wait, no, he specifically said that some girls would continue to be pachinko exclusive (but they'd always be possible drops and they'd just be much more likely to drop from the pachinko during their event than they are outside of it) and the "black market" selection would be limited to the event girls who are NOT designated as pachinko exclusives. So the divide between "premium" content and "standard" content is still there.

Anyway, since the idea suggested a token reward/drop which would also be possible to pay kobans for, the balance of all the costs and drop rates of such a plan would be subject to heavy scrutiny by the devs if they consider it. They might have their own ideas about how much things should cost and how hard it should be to save up the tokens to buy something, as well as whether or not they'd agree with the topic creator's idea to draw a line where event variations of existing girls would be pachinko exclusive and only the brand new girls would appear in the black market (maybe the devs would want it the other way around as thanks for those who do buy kobans).

I'm pretty sure the topic creator gets that his values are examples and up for debate, that they're not an absolute final word on what should be used.

For the most part, I concur with what was stated here.

After grasping the basic understanding of the OP's suggestion through his example, I find myself in disagreement with his solution. However, I do not feel that he is 1) a cry-baby, and 2) selfish. I don't want to start anything, but I only see Greetingz' statement on the matter as being fairly openly antagonistic against a user who IS sharing constructive criticism. Both share a mutual passion, as do we all. Where else would this thread come from if not out of passion and a yearning to see the game do well? Let's not create a divide between one another with callus remarks, but rather appreciate and encourage cordial debate. (This is one of the few reasons many, including myself, have left and no longer participate in the Harem Heroes Discord.)

There is certainly a difference between, as you said, "premium" and "standard" content with the OP's suggestion. A user will still need to purchase kobans to try their luck with the exclusive epic pachinko haremettes while also needing to play the game to obtain the event exclusive girls. His approach aligns with the already existing format, albeit differently.

I look forward to the recently announced changes and seeing what approach Kinkoid will take in regards to this matter - if any at all. I for one would prefer to see a redesign in terms of level balance and drop rates. The rumored inclusion of guilds also intrigues me from a community point of view. Perhaps the inclusion of an in-game chat as well?

This is my two cents. I think it should be more reasonable the price. If they asked maybe 1-5 or 5-10 bucks for an epic girl than in the long term, they will make more money than in the short term. If the prices are too high, you are losing potential customers. It's not that people have to pay that bother them. I myself pay the Patron each month. It's the insane amount.

It's true a bunch of content is locked away that most of the community will never see. It's just hard to justify 1000 Korbans for 10 spins. Most of the gear, I can't use. Then I view the new singles scene once. (There really should be a feature to save the image when you unlock girls so you can go back to look at their scenes) Once I got 1200 Korbans. I spent it on epic spin 10x I didn't feel like I got my money worth. Those Korbans were given to me via promotion 300 each for however long you are active. If I spent actual money on it. I'd be unhappy with the return.

I know people have to make money. I get that it's not cheap. My suggestion is this. You are missing out on let's say 500 customers who might never buy due to high price. What happens if we lower price to even 5 bucks for 10x spins.Those people also potentially possible they'll support on Patron and become loyal customers that are the real value there. People who weren't buying before are now buying. It might take longer, those customers will be happier. Chances are the more popular this becomes the more content it can create. You can make some money in short term, but in my humble opinion, you'll make much more with lower prices.

Originally Posted by Icemanfrost

This is my two cents. I think it should be more reasonable the price.

I agree that having epic pachinko spins cheaper would be better, cause as its now you pay a lot for premium content aka girls cause the items dropped by pachinko you can buy or get from contests. What girls give you is 4 pieces of small "avatars" images and 3 upgrading scenes. They also give you 1 more girl of course and a bunch of cash/h. But at least for now, till the tomorrows supposed big update, cash/h is useless for old players that already maxed they upgrades.

So you basically pay 900 kobans which is quite a bit of real world money to get a single guaranteed girl, chances to spin them on a single pull are probably little to none. And the girl gives you just few pictures, nearly no story at all, one more cash button to press (which could be considered a hindrance if before and after update cash will be useless for longer players). FKG game I mentioned in my solution to OP's problem gives you 6* girls for cheaper (especially on promo deals), you can often actually choose which one you want (as you get a ticket to exchange in the shop), and you get a girl thats better than 5* and lower girls you get from events/normal gacha spins, you get a normal proper h-scene with voice-over, and a bit of story in that scene, and when they translate and add character quests you get even more story/personality of that "wifu". We will see what the big update brings, but for now for me at least what HH "premium content" gives isn't worth my time/money.

Originally Posted by Icemanfrost

(There really should be a feature to save the image when you unlock girls so you can go back to look at their scenes)

All the images you can access whenever you want, they aren't like you suggest a one-time stuff. You just go to harem portion of game and select the girl you wanna revisit the upgrade scenes and click on the 3 stars next to "Affection" label. Heck, you can actually save the images too, just right and "save image as". Doesn't save text, but saves the image.

Originally Posted by Eversor86

I agree that having epic pachinko spins cheaper would be better, cause as its now you pay a lot for premium content aka girls cause the items dropped by pachinko you can buy or get from contests. What girls give you are 4 pieces of small "avatars" images and 3 upgrading scenes. They also give you 1 more girl of course and a bunch of cash/h. But at least for now, till the tomorrows supposed big update, cash/h is useless for old players that already maxed they upgrades.

So you basically pay 900 kobans which are quite a bit of real world money to get a single guaranteed girl, chances to spin them on a single pull are probably little to none. And the girl gives you just a few pictures, nearly no story at all, one more cash button to press (which could be considered a hindrance if before and after update cash will be useless for longer players). FKG game I mentioned in my solution to OP's problem gives you 6* girls for cheaper (especially on promo deals), you can often actually choose which one you want (as you get a ticket to exchange in the shop), and you get a girl that better than 5* and lower girls you get from events/normal gacha spins, you get a normal proper h-scene with voice-over, and a bit of story in that scene, and when they translate and add character quests you get even more story/personality of that "wife". We will see what the big update brings, but for now for me at least what HH "premium content" gives isn't worth my time/money.



All the images you can access whenever you want, they aren't like you suggest a one-time stuff. You just go to harem portion of the game and select the girl you wanna revisit the upgrade scenes and click on the 3 stars next to "Affection" label. Heck, you can actually save the images too, just right and "save image as". Doesn't save text, but saves the image.

I read some where vaguely the reason for not proving a way to save the girl sex scenes in a photo gallery like other games have. They don't want it to get "too much unwanted attention" this is an adult game. I firmly believe we are mature enough to have the images saved in a neat little photo gallery without having to resort to saving the image to the PC. This is a mature game. I don't know why certain people would be offended by it.

I don't know the solution for the epic girls. I do know you want to push people to become loyal and engaged. Those people who are passionate about the game will come on the forum and en-gage. They are loyal fans. I have another suggestion. Perhaps a feature that costs 20 bucks a month. That allows you to re-charge your energy twice as fast or a bit faster than now. Perhaps it gives the free number of Korbans a month.

If it's affordable, more people will buy. Chances are they will re-buy. You also give your most loyal fans access to more content. It's just not worth it to me for the small gear and the girl for the price. You have considered how much people are willing to pay. 15-20 bucks a month seems to be sweet spot

other company's warcraft, z girls, all have sub type of service. I never paid for the epic roll when I first played thw and on to recharge my energy. I mostly waited with great paitence to build up my money. An automated system for the money, where you don't have log in every six hours would be helpful. Perhaps for Sub service, you can offer free automation for money as a way encourage people to sign up.

Originally Posted by Icemanfrost

I read some where vaguely the reason for not proving a way to save the girl sex scenes in a photo gallery like other games have. They don't want it to get "too much unwanted attention" this is an adult game. I firmly believe we are mature enough to have the images saved in a neat little photo gallery without having to resort to saving the image to the PC. This is a mature game. I don't know why certain people would be offended by it.

You can already view the images again at ANY time after you unlock them, without saving them to your PC. That's what the guy you quoted told you... They just don't want them posted online without their permission, because they want to keep it as the lure for people to actually play the game.