Thread: Starter Pack Value

The biggest problem really is that in a lot of cases you want your tank to be able to dish out some damage as well, so "classic" heavies won't be used too much. A second problem we have not bumped into much yet, but that does appear is the fact that heavies tank multiple units. If i bring up that last magic city map again, if i had put Deine in the middle to tank the first big golem, that'd be fine for that golem, but she would have eventually tanked both golems at once, killing her fast. Being able to tank more than one unit is often rather bad for endgame tanks since they do not want to take on the "boss" AND their underlings.

Heavies pretty much only exist to block tons of units, but in a lot of cases it's better to just kill said units faster with some unit that doesn't require their skill to deal good damage.

Originally Posted by Tenhou

Being able to tank more than one unit is often rather bad for endgame tanks since they do not want to take on the "boss" AND their underlings.

Easy: Park Elyse nearby! Both of their SAWs give Deine a healthy 5k defense to tank anything (that is not ignoring defense) AND wreck all of their faces at the same time

Well, for all 30 seconds of Seismic Fist's duration, but yeah.

Originally Posted by lolix

The problem apears when other classes that are better then you in other areas , are still better then you in what should be your speciallity.

Nah, see, the cure to that is worse than the disease and the multiple tank classes genie is already out of the bottle. Like I said, tanking is a binary role. You can either take the hits or you can't and after that it becomes a question of what kind of utility you bring to the table. So you can't really have Heavies be a one trick pony AND heavily role protect their trick so they're meaningfully better AND still let other tanking classes be viable as mega boss tanks. That needle is just too fucking narrow to be threaded in a game where most of the top end tanks are already locked behind the gacha paywall. The last thing the average player needs is another unit to join Elyse in being virtually mandatory for majins. On a per player basis the game is more interesting and better balanced for having multiple viable tanks in the unit pool even if that means one trick pony tanks suffer a bit by comparison to the all-stars. Rolling any of that back would be unwise compared to simply acknowledging that high rarity heavies can and should be doing more than taking punches to the face, something which the devs thankfully seem to realize now. And fwiw, it's not like Bernice and Gellius have truly faded into obscurity, either. Being overly specialized isn't really a problem until you get to black tier units that are expected to carry teams on their back. Bernice and Gellius still have value because by tanking above their rarity tier they're very useful for free players, newbies or people who decided to chase other things with their gacha pulls. They're not always the best solutions, but sometimes you need to take what you can get and compared to Cornelia they're reasonably common.

and that can be easily done by making the heavy's defense scale on the number of units blocked.

You block 1 unit ? no additional boost. You tank multiple units ? You get a boost in defense power. That way some duelists or other end game tank units (that are not heavies) can still be the ones to tank solo bosses , while heavies still being the best overall tanks while facing multiple units. That way you don't have to overbuff heavies to the point where they are a step over everything in terms of tanking , even megabosses , but you don't have them fade into obscurity either by having them incapable of tanking 3 stronger then average units without heavy healer support.


How is this not a good ideea ?

It's not a terrible idea, but it'd be kinda odd that you might actually want to leave goblins and weenie shit alive when faced with a sufficiently mixed group so you have your buff against the big stuff. A niche use to be sure, but odd. It also invites the question of whether the devs actually want units blocking multiple tankbusters. My guess would be no but then again I'm not a mind reader.

Originally Posted by lolix

and that can be easily done by making the heavy's defense scale on the number of units blocked.

You block 1 unit ? no additional boost. You tank multiple units ? You get a boost in defense power. That way some duelists or other end game tank units (that are not heavies) can still be the ones to tank solo bosses , while heavies still being the best overall tanks while facing multiple units. That way you don't have to overbuff heavies to the point where they are a step over everything in terms of tanking , even megabosses , but you don't have them fade into obscurity either by having them incapable of tanking 3 stronger then average units without heavy healer support.


How is this not a good ideea ?

Actually, I'd almost say that if they were to do something like that, it might be better to have it act as a debuff to incoming damage based on number of blocked enemies. The reason being that with how armour works, it can't reduce an enemy attack below 10%. Considering how high tank armour tends to be, many enemies are already dealing the minimum amount of damage. By reducing their attack rather than raising the defense of the tank, it would be able to reduce that damage below the normal minimum. Of course, this does still run into the problem kayfabe noted that it might result in the odd situation where you could tank something if there are also goblins attacking you, but not if it is alone. There is also the issue of if the attack debuff would be percent based or just a number, with potential issues for either.

c'mon people...how many mega bosses are there that spawn alongside goblins ? And most of the times you use a heavy , you will have some dps to clear the enemies.....and goblins are really easy to kill. Hell , even assuming no other dps is placed , the heavy can kill the goblins pretty fast because they are weak.


The only situation where goblins would be alive for a longer period of time , it would be if the first blocked unit would be a boss/megaboss....and honestly those don't tend to spwn before goblin spawn.

well, to add two cents to the main topic, if you are buying crystals anyway then you have 0 reasons NOT to get the starter pack.

Originally Posted by lolix

c'mon people...how many mega bosses are there that spawn alongside goblins ?

There's not that many goblin and megaboss combos but mummies are a reasonably common enemy and their entire shtick is that they come in waves and start out weak but turn into tankbusters if you try to AOE them down from behind a multi-blocker. A setup where you're corralling them with a heavy and carefully thinning the herd out with single target DPS is already common operating procedure and your proposed buff would very good in that scenario. Honestly, I don't really intend that as purely criticism of your idea, however--counter-intuitive solutions to problems are often an interesting feature in games rather than just a bug. Your idea hit me as interesting and I basically just started thinking out loud about odd ways such an ability could be used. The only real issue I have with your idea is the part where it implies you're envisioning a future where heavies can tank multiple heavy hitters and I'm unsure how far in that direction the devs are willing to go. After all, heavies can already do that... up to a point.

I bought my Alicia since I needed to get to 150 SC spending last month

didn't use her