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JessMini
06-08-2016, 07:57 AM
I was just wondering how you guys treated the normal missions. Do you replay the same map over and over again until you complete it, or do you just clear the missions and go back to non-completed maps at a later date?

I've currently completed the first 10 missions as well as the maps 11-2, 11-3, 11-5 and 12-2. The other maps in missions 11 & 12 I have only cleared, not completed. Now the problem is, I've cleared 11-1 approximately 60 times over the last couple of days, but I still fail every single time. After doing the math, it seems that the map has a 0,78% chance of being completed. This basically means that I can keep trying another thousand times and still fail a thousand times.

What do you guys do in situations like this? Do you just continue to attempt the same mission over and over again or do you just ignore it? And if you ignore it, why? You'll have to come back to it at some point, might as well do it now, right? The issue after all is not that our units are too weak, it's the fact that there's a 0,78% chance of hitting the correct RNGs, i.e. coming back "later" doesn't help. So how exactly should I proceed?

Drip
06-08-2016, 08:17 AM
Later maps will generate more experience points, which in turn means your stamina go up as you level a bit faster, so at some point, you'll reach the point where returning to those old maps to get 3 medals out of them costs (relatively) "small change" in stamina, so you start doing them again to burn your last stamina before heading to work or going to sleep or something.

May sound odd, but when you have 12-3 on farm (35 stamina), you care more about the Secret Garden that might spawn at its end (50 stamina), and at times end up with odd leftovers, like 60 stamina just a few minutes before you have to log for several hours. And, since you probably already completed 12-3 once you have it on farm, and don't have the stamina to deal with a possible Secret Garden spawning after it, that 60 left-over stamina might as well be used for one or two attempts at a lower level zone that was only "cleared" but not "completed".

Rupturez
06-08-2016, 08:55 AM
I completed everything under 10 so now I just try to get the last maps in 11 & 12 that I don't have. I don't mind playing the missions in 11 over and over again because they spawn the advanced secret garden, so it's basically the same thing as 12-3 except I won't get ampys. I finished 11-1 this morning, I feel your pain it's a horrible map, but 10-5 took me even longer.

Edit: And I only will attempt missions if I have atleast 80 spare stamina after completing it to be able to do the secret garden if it spawns.

Meister
06-08-2016, 09:12 AM
So I reran 11-1 just to see what's in there since completing it I never looked back, and I just cleared it again with all pest encountered. If this helps, I ran the map without changing anything and with slow squads(420-540 speed), the helper is faster than my 1st squad. But it seems that the real major problem in that map is RNG and if it's the case then my above advice will be just a little help or not at all.

JessMini
06-08-2016, 09:54 AM
So I reran 11-1 just to see what's in there since completing it I never looked back, and I just cleared it again with all pest encountered. If this helps, I ran the map without changing anything and with slow squads(420-540 speed), the helper is faster than my 1st squad. But it seems that the real major problem in that map is RNG and if it's the case then my above advice will be just a little help or not at all.

That's the exact strategy I'm doing it with, standard setup with all units (including helper) under 500 speed. Basically I'm just having bad bad luck in that my units always end up going one of the paths wrong, but if you managed to complete it so easily then you're pretty lucky what with it being a 0,78% chance.. x)



Edit: And I only will attempt missions if I have atleast 80 spare stamina after completing it to be able to do the secret garden if it spawns.

Hm, I've been ignoring those 80 stamina secret gardens because of the cost and because I want to complete all of Mission 11 before starting to farm 12-3.. Should I stop doing that and instead always do the 80 stamina secret when it pops up?


Edit: Worst part is how they always make sure to go ALL possible paths except for one, so as to waste as much of my time as possible. And they always fail at the "last" RNG arrow, keeping my hopes up until the very end: http://i.imgur.com/y9JbGDC.png

Tenhou
06-08-2016, 09:59 AM
I usually 3*d all maps but when i reached the 10th area i decided to just push on to 12-3 and stop there.

Currently, a few weeks later, i have now 3*d all the maps.

Drip
06-08-2016, 10:01 AM
That's the exact strategy I'm doing it with, standard setup with all units (including helper) under 500 speed. Basically I'm just having bad bad luck in that my units always end up going one of the paths wrong, but if you managed to complete it so easily then you're pretty lucky what with it being a 0,78% chance.. x)




Hm, I've been ignoring those 80 stamina secret gardens because of the cost and because I want to complete all of Mission 11 before starting to farm 12-3.. Should I stop doing that and instead always do the 80 stamina secret when it pops up?

Always do the 80 stamina SG, they give lods of gold manyus!

Rupturez
06-08-2016, 10:57 AM
Hm, I've been ignoring those 80 stamina secret gardens because of the cost and because I want to complete all of Mission 11 before starting to farm 12-3.. Should I stop doing that and instead always do the 80 stamina secret when it pops up?

Yeah definitely take the gardens when they pop up, it's basically where you get most of your power.

Lied
06-08-2016, 11:38 AM
I usually 3*d all maps but when i reached the 10th area i decided to just push on to 12-3 and stop there.

Currently, a few weeks later, i have now 3*d all the maps.

This. I used to keep replaying maps to get 3*, but a lot of the map 10 areas are a pain (well 10-5 anyway) and I didn't want to spend a lot of time replaying map 10 stuff when map 11+ spawn the better gardens.

Miu
06-08-2016, 12:48 PM
Same for me, but I stopped doing 3* at 8-2. I think that was the one with a huge difficulty jump and there was no way for my team to clear it unless I stacked everyone on one tent.

kojaku
06-08-2016, 02:03 PM
Yeah, pretty much the same, at first i stopped 3* at maps 8 or 9. Then i started using my leftover stamina for some tries to 3* them eventually, also, because i wanteed the gems for limited 2. And for maps 11 and 12 i just farmed them for the garden untili got the 3 stars.

I'm still missing 12-5 due to lacking a tiny bit of power to 3* reliably (i could bruto force it until all goes well though), and 10-5, becaue 10-5 isa rel pain and 50 stamina gardens suck.

By the way, may i know how are you calculating those 0.78% odds ? As far as my calculations go, you need to win 4 coin flips in a row, so that should be 1/16, or in other words, a 6.25%. Still pretty darn low though

Unregistered
06-08-2016, 03:26 PM
That's odd, 11-1 is the only one in the 11 series that I've 3-medaled. Did it the first time and only looked back at it after reading this thread. And I JUST finally got 10-5 completed today...that was the hell map that made me switch from getting 3 medals on every map before going to the next one.

In addition to the rest of 11, I have 2 more to 3-medal in 12 (plus a smattering of maps in the daily category) before I can totally retire to 12-3 farming.

JessMini
06-08-2016, 04:34 PM
By the way, may i know how are you calculating those 0.78% odds ? As far as my calculations go, you need to win 4 coin flips in a row, so that should be 1/16, or in other words, a 6.25%. Still pretty darn low though

Well, I thought there was a total of 7x random-direction nodes that I need to pass. 0,5 times itself 7 times is approx. 0,0078. But I actually just noticed that the first RNG node (bottom left) is irrelevant as both paths lead to the first mob (hadn't noticed), so I guess it's a total of 6, in other words 0,5*0,5*0,5*0,5*0,5*0,5 = 0,0156 = 1,6%. We're doing the same math, I'm just writing it in a less than "intelligent" manner, but I'm sure you understand. :p But, there aren't 4 coin flips, there are 6 coin flips in the level.

Hm, wait, I might be thinking about this all wrong.. Basically I multiply by 0,5 for each unit that passes a 50/50 node. There's two paths at the top of the map, that's 0,5*0,5. Another two paths at the very bottom, 0,5*0,5*0,5*0,5. And finally I need two units to actually get down TO the fork at the very bottom, so that's another two: 0,5*0,5*0,5*0,5*0,5*0,5 = 0,0156 = 1,6%. If I'm way off, I'm sorry! ;;




By the way, thanks everyone for your input. I now know how to proceed with the missions, and I'll be sure to never skip the 80 stamina secret garden!

Zandel
06-08-2016, 10:30 PM
For me the 12 maps were easier to clear then the 11's... I have all maps lvl 1-9 clear and all but 10-5 on lvl 10 as well as all lvl 12 but only 11-4 is clear in the 11 set.

I'm interested tho, is doing Normal missions and hoping for the 80 stam secret garden better then running the 80 stam manyu missions on those days?

I've been doing the manyu missions myself but i've always wondered about it.

Ikki
06-08-2016, 11:39 PM
i´ve been farming 12-3 from today and, at least for me, the 80 stamina secret garden is waaay better than the 80 stamina manyu daily one, i´ve got only like 2 or 3 lvl 100 manyus from 3 runs of the manyu daily, while in the 80 garden i got 3 red lvl 100 manyus in only 1 run, the only downside its the rng in here to get the 4 chest, you get better rewards either way, without mentioning the chance of getting some ampies in 12-3

Unregistered
06-08-2016, 11:50 PM
But, there aren't 4 coin flips, there are 6 coin flips in the level.

This is where the problem is. There are only 4 coin flips. 2 to get to the bottom fork, and then 1 at each fork.
The first squad to get to a fork does not count, since either direction is ok.

Zandel
06-09-2016, 03:55 AM
This is where the problem is. There are only 4 coin flips. 2 to get to the bottom fork, and then 1 at each fork.
The first squad to get to a fork does not count, since either direction is ok.

You are forgetting the 2 up top as well mate. Without getting those two as well you will not clear the map.

- - - Updated - - -


i´ve been farming 12-3 from today and, at least for me, the 80 stamina secret garden is waaay better than the 80 stamina manyu daily one, i´ve got only like 2 or 3 lvl 100 manyus from 3 runs of the manyu daily, while in the 80 garden i got 3 red lvl 100 manyus in only 1 run, the only downside its the rng in here to get the 4 chest, you get better rewards either way, without mentioning the chance of getting some ampies in 12-3

Yes but to get that secret garden you need to spend more stam and hope for the best. So what i'm interested in is which is better based on stam used?

Say you have 240 stam that is 3 runs of the daily vs 2 'possible' secret gardens... now you get to do that about 2 times during the space of 1 day so it's 6 runs of the daily vs 2-4 secret gardens (most likely chance to only get 2 when done in 2 x 240 stam hits).

That was my reasons for doing the dailies. Slightly less chance for lvl 100s per run but with 6 runs that is 18-24 chests vs 6-8 (12-16 if you get really lucky and spawn 4 gardens but that is like 1 in a million) for the same stam.

Ikki
06-09-2016, 03:59 AM
if you put if that way then the manyu daily is better (it sucks when you expect to get the secret garden and it doesnt pops up, god that makes me mad) if you really need those 2 types of manyu (since its locked for purple/yellow and red/blue) then i guess its better, stamina wise its better 80 vs posible 115

Zerana
06-09-2016, 04:02 AM
I'm highly stubborn. I keep replaying missions until I get 3 stars. That is unless I need to farm Manyu or something.

Drip
06-09-2016, 04:05 AM
When you don't get an SG after 12-3, you'll get either a boss (equipment seeds) or nothing. Either way, it only cost 35 stamina then.
To add to that, the Sacred Beast ampys drop from the campaign maps, not from Secret Garden. So far, I seem to get a Sacred Beast about once every 3-4 runs.
So I figure, they're both decent maps to do.

Rupturez
06-09-2016, 04:09 AM
The difference is gold and experience. Doing the Manyu daily gets you low gold/exp, whereas 12-3 is reliable gold and experience.

sniddy
06-09-2016, 03:54 PM
I just dont see gold manyus enought from th daily to make not farming 12-3 better and hoping for amps

I did a bit of 12-5 farming to prove my bad-assary given how many times that mission annoyed me

Ancarius
06-09-2016, 06:11 PM
Well the Manyuu Daily is better, if you don't need the money. After you finished the evolving and are just sitting in 12-5, stop using the level 5 Manyuu's then you will start piling up Gold.

Unregistered
06-10-2016, 08:30 AM
You are forgetting the 2 up top as well mate. Without getting those two as well you will not clear the map.

I'm not forgetting anything. You send 3 in the top 2 camps, so that they get past the switch. Then you have 2 squads that go through a single fork. The first squad isn't a coin flip, it goes the 'correct' direction. The 2nd squad is a flip.

The bottom area, you have 2 squads that both have to take the bottom route, that's 2 more flips.

Finally, those 2 approach a fork where the first one goes the right direction, and the 2nd squad is a flip.

4 flips.

JessMini
06-10-2016, 01:46 PM
The first squad isn't a coin flip, it goes the 'correct' direction. The 2nd squad is a flip.

See, that's the part I didn't think of. The first squad has a 100% chance to go either direction, and the second squad has a 50% chance to go the remaining direction. In other words, when two squads are faced with a fork, it's always a 50% of getting both paths.

In my earlier messy post, I wrote each fork as a 0,5 * 0,5 = 0,25, when really it should be 1 * 0,5 = 0,5. Not like there's a 25% chance of getting both paths in a two-way fork, lol.. Anyway, that's why I thought it was 6 flips earlier. ^^;