PDA

View Full Version : Let's discuss about total powers and ATK stats, are they misleading?



HakuYowane
09-13-2016, 12:37 PM
I am sure you (at some point) have wondered why some 4 star characters seem to be stronger than a lot of 5 stars event girls.
(Most notable Di Yu, Snowflake and St Paulia) when you sort them from total power?
But does that actually mean they are actually stronger?

I think not, but before i continue, in case you don't know how total power is calculated by each squad.
It's quite simple, it's just the sum of each character's stats (ATK,DEF and HP) excluding SPD

Some characters have a lot of HP and that makes them go up in the list but i don't think that necessarily means they are stronger than other characters.
Some characters have high HP but have low def which under-compensates compared to other characters who have low HP but high enough DEF to survive longer than the high HP characters, thus dealing more total damage over all depending on how much damage they actualy do per turn

So how do you assure your squads are optimally sorted?
You might want to sort them by ATK, they might die sooner and actually deal less total damage than a balanced squad, but are those actually the characters that deal the most damage?

I have a theory but i am not sure about this so i would really appreciate if someone confirms this.
You can't know the true damage a character does by simply looking at their ATK stat or buffs.
Have you noticed that the characters which higher ATK are the ones who don't have multiple hit moves?
For example Amaryllis the 2 star flowerknight (compared to other 2 star ones) or Edelweiss the 5 star one.

I am not sure about this but i believe damage is calculated on each hit, so obviously characters who have multi hit moves need to have slightly or greatly less ATK to balance it out.
That's why characters with only one hit moves have higher ATK stats.
This would mean that the characters listed from higher ATK are not actually the ones who do the most damage, that's something to think about.

I think you can't know the true damage a character does unless you count each hit and apply the damage formula for each.

Maybe i am missing something i don't know? What do you guys think?

By the way if you want to know how your character's defense efficiency is like, here's this formula.

(HP/(1000-(DEF/4))
This basically calculates in how many hits your character would die if they get hit by a monster that deals 1000 damage (2000 atk)
disregarding any kind of buff or randomness.
The higher the number you get, the most turns your character will survive.
It's science

A Time to Screw
09-13-2016, 12:57 PM
None of this would be a problem if we had a "Sort by Waifu" button. That's what really matters.

Anyways, passive skills are a thing. Usually, the wider the party buff, the less effective the unit would be alone.

Toad Lily has a total power of only around 15800~ or so, pretty low compared to most other (gacha) 5*. Her attack skill isn't anything to write home about either, an AOE that does low damage due to her low ATK stat. But she's pretty useful if you look at her passive skills. She bolsters the rest of the party's ATK and makes them survive waves of pests.


Just play with who you like. Love conquers all except rainbow wallet power

Eab1990
09-13-2016, 01:28 PM
Reminds me of that rainbow tier list that 2ch posted.

Most of the ones we have are D-tier because they're single/double/random-target. Sakura being the exception because her bloomed form gave her the 1.2x increased skill rate passive.


S-rank: Broom, Cherry, Viola (yukata)
A-rank: Sakura, Saffron, Nerine
B-rank: Acacia, Iberis, Epidendrum (swimsuit), Oncidium (bride), Snowdrop, Dendrobium, Euonymus, Serissa, Lycoris (miko), Maple
C-rank: Apricot, Ionocidium, Lagurus, Victoria, Victoria (bride), Katakuri, Cattleya, Christmas Rose, Fritillaria, Garden Peony, Hoya, Hollyhock, Dianthus, Ghost Spurge, Habranthus, Viola, Lycoris, Black Baccara, Pumpkin, Ardisia, Mimosa, Mistletoe, Kerria
D-rank: Anemone, Ume (Mei Plumblossom), Cactus (Cactace), Daisy, Dogwood, Flowering Peach, Helenium, Red Ginger (Alpinia)

Unregistered
09-13-2016, 01:57 PM
It's OK for you to do this with your own squad composition. However, you should remember that most people aren't going to bother with an in-depth analysis of their helper squads. They'll have favorite allies they know they can rely on for certain performance parameters, but if they're looking at new helpers they'll look at total power first (which gives the edge to the tanky girls irrespective of their true strength), then speed and/or special abilities (Edelweiss, Lilac, Chocolate Cosmos, etc.). Some will look for multiple rainbows, which if they're maxed is about the same as total power anyway. None will go to the wiki to research whether a low-power girl's higher attack value will compensate for her lack of HP...they'll just assume that person just doesn't have any higher-power girls and possibly pick another helper.

IvanLedah21
09-13-2016, 03:55 PM
It's OK for you to do this with your own squad composition. However, you should remember that most people aren't going to bother with an in-depth analysis of their helper squads. They'll have favorite allies they know they can rely on for certain performance parameters, but if they're looking at new helpers they'll look at total power first (which gives the edge to the tanky girls irrespective of their true strength), then speed and/or special abilities (Edelweiss, Lilac, Chocolate Cosmos, etc.). Some will look for multiple rainbows, which if they're maxed is about the same as total power anyway. None will go to the wiki to research whether a low-power girl's higher attack value will compensate for her lack of HP...they'll just assume that person just doesn't have any higher-power girls and possibly pick another helper.

Basically this. If you don't already know certain girls' images and know those girls have certain useful abilities (Edelweiss, Toad Lily, Chocolate Cosmos even, etc.) then you're going to end up picking based on three factors:
Speed
Total Power
Rainbows

Personally, I don't even care about the stats too much because my own squads are strong enough to clear all current content. So I pick based on Speed alone, really (helps with certain maps to have an extra 650+ speed squad, I have a 630ish and a 700+ but the other two squads are like 470 and 540). However, if I'm running one of the pest-heavy maps like 12-5, I tend to focus on the presence of the Edelweiss/TL combo just because it's useful (even though I once had my Squad 1 reach the boss of 12-5 at about 15% HP each due to small pests and they still killed it without casualties cuz they're all evolved 50+ rainbows it still helps)

Drip
09-13-2016, 04:08 PM
Basically this. If you don't already know certain girls' images and know those girls have certain useful abilities (Edelweiss, Toad Lily, Chocolate Cosmos even, etc.) then you're going to end up picking based on three factors:
Speed
Total Power
Rainbows

Personally, I don't even care about the stats too much because my own squads are strong enough to clear all current content. So I pick based on Speed alone, really (helps with certain maps to have an extra 650+ speed squad, I have a 630ish and a 700+ but the other two squads are like 470 and 540). However, if I'm running one of the pest-heavy maps like 12-5, I tend to focus on the presence of the Edelweiss/TL combo just because it's useful (even though I once had my Squad 1 reach the boss of 12-5 at about 15% HP each due to small pests and they still killed it without casualties cuz they're all evolved 50+ rainbows it still helps)
Leucocoryne has the same ability Edelweiss has, and I'm almost certain I've seen it on another girl as well.
Not sure if Toad Lily's ability is available elsewhere. At least, I haven't seen it (yet).

Aavar
09-13-2016, 06:20 PM
Leucocoryne has the same ability Edelweiss has, and I'm almost certain I've seen it on another girl as well.
Not sure if Toad Lily's ability is available elsewhere. At least, I haven't seen it (yet).

2 girls have [Stage] -50% Dam from small pests when moving ability.
- Japanese Iris and Toad Lily

3 girls currently have the ability "+10% HP for all Squad members after moving through a Pest Nest Node"
Edelweiss evolved Dianthus and evolved Leucocoryne

IvanLedah21
09-14-2016, 07:29 AM
Leucocoryne has the same ability Edelweiss has, and I'm almost certain I've seen it on another girl as well.
Not sure if Toad Lily's ability is available elsewhere. At least, I haven't seen it (yet).

Japanese Iris has Toad Lily's ability as well

Wow, way to read the whole thread, me. Poster above already said that, 13 hours ago >.<

Drip
09-14-2016, 07:39 AM
Just wondering now if someone is running around with all five anti-pest girls in a single squad yet. I'm missing the two new girls myself, but I do have Toad Lilly, Edelweiss and Leucocoryne in my helper squad. If that squad happens to be in the front position on 12-5, it usually arrives at the final bosses at full health, which is nice. When I get Alpinia leveled to Evolved-40 in a few weeks, I'll add her to the squad to increase its speed to 888