Some advices + Shizuka

[Nero010]

I think its about time. But lemme start with the first question.

1. I just lucked out to Summon Shizuka from Shrine, have some viarity in my units already though (but no samurais). Id like to hear what you guys think about her as i never used samurais until now. Please tell me, senpai!

2. Im gonna put my team below and ask what you think if it would be worth for me to invest into her considering what i have?

3. Since i never did this until now... everything has a first time. I would ask for suggestions what you think i should work on next, what i should work on in my team and maybe what i should look at AWing.

4. What do you think my team is generaly lacking? Any roles? Any holes i need to fill? (pun... not intended?)

Thanks in advance!!!

2206
2205

I put the old one in a spoiler to seek new advices. I saved up a lot of SC - brought some additional ones and rolled for 250 SC. Cause heck i want sybilla, sue or marr and fignela was fine too. Didnt work, as expected. Well i got my first black - and second. And a few units that throw in new options. For example... the old discussion about me needing another lighning rod and wether Emilia or Kerry is kinda obsolete now. Got Dhalia and Thetis and Grace. But enough blabla. First of all i give a few pictures so everyone knows what they can work with

For everyone whos interested in all pulls - all in all not bad. Got my first 3 plat dupes. Feed Marnie to my main Marnie already as well as Shizuka (from plat ticket) to my main Shizuka.
3509

My current roaster with some honorable mentions
3510

and now the new units that i got my eyes on riddling if and who i should use and/or focus in first
3511

A few of my thoughts... Farne and Grace are sure great. Not sure who i would want to focus first though. Map wide regen when deployed - or +10mr on all melees when in sortie? Both are huge magic bombs (sadly not usefull during this event i guess). Also... since those two are my first premium blacks im realy interested in the question how good these two are among the other blacks?

Fignela has killer atk and atk speed paired with belinda and i can -1cr her (when i got the resources). I also got my first Yuyu though. I havent beaten War of Magic yet and since im going to need black fairys now... who do i need to focus in to beat that map and can i?

Also no feng shui user but -yeay- Camilla. Im not realy in desperate need of more healing besides Iris and fedora but it sure is an important addition finaly having a plat healer.

I have had no valk besides Emilia(Kerry) and my only lightning rod been Sherry or Anya with lots of UP. Now all of a sudden i get Dhalia, Thetis and Liddy. I know that Dhalia fills the mage killer niche but i got no clue who would make most sense focusing first for my roaster.

And last but not least - finaly a melee slot healer. Filling a niche i dont have yet.

Uhhgh. I dont have a lot of DCs. Or Black Fairys after Saki and Anya. I will have to go step by step. Please flood me with your opinions.

[IvanLedah21]

Really solid looking team there. You do seem to be short on Lightning Rods though, seems Sherry is your only one. Might want to level another one (Kerry or Themis I guess, Lucille is too expensive for that role, Elva probably is as well)

Next on AW list I'd pick Saki or Zola, maybe Mehlis. Saki's UP cost drops by 2 on AW (part of being a Ninja) and she's a fast attacking range on melee slot, Zola loses 10 range in exchange for faster attacking and is super-helpful on Crystal Keeper's X and G tiers (and earlier but high level archers suffice for H and below), plus she can switch to magic damage against armor using skill. Mehlis attacks faster and is a cheaper alternative to Garania, with range extension instead of blast radius increase.

As for Shizuka, with the unit rebalance a few months ago, Samurai now have the stats to justify the cost, more or less, and Shizuka is the best of the bunch. She's a mid-map sweeper for anti-rushing and has decent bulk to take a hit or two. Worth a look, especially as a cheaper alternative to Elva (bulk is comparable until Elva's Paladin class AW buff at 50% HP kicks in; slower attacks but hits 2 at once; heals self instead of attacking faster in terms of skill)

[buttlover]

High attk, 2/3 block and can attack all enemies blocked.

Worth.

Not sure what you can do to change your team composition.
There is little choice other than hoping the bi-weekly event unit is good.
Unless you decide to gatcha, and thats all you can hope.

That said, you could use a magic ranged melee slot, which will be useful in the magic academy part of the story line when it comes out.

[Nero010]

High attk, 2/3 block and can attack all enemies blocked.

Worth.

Not sure what you can do to change your team composition.
There is little choice other than hoping the bi-weekly event unit is good.
Unless you decide to gatcha, and thats all you can hope.

That said, you could use a magic ranged melee slot, which will be useful in the magic academy part of the story line when it comes out.

Since i started after horace event, i guess... at least i have Anemone for that job?
Im more or less asking about what i lack so i know what i should hope for to cross my way :D And also to know if i need to invest in the gold version of that class or just waste my resources.



Really solid looking team there. You do seem to be short on Lightning Rods though, seems Sherry is your only one. Might want to level another one (Kerry or Themis I guess, Lucille is too expensive for that role, Elva probably is as well)

Next on AW list I'd pick Saki or Zola, maybe Mehlis. Saki's UP cost drops by 2 on AW (part of being a Ninja) and she's a fast attacking range on melee slot, Zola loses 10 range in exchange for faster attacking and is super-helpful on Crystal Keeper's X and G tiers (and earlier but high level archers suffice for H and below), plus she can switch to magic damage against armor using skill. Mehlis attacks faster and is a cheaper alternative to Garania, with range extension instead of blast radius increase.

As for Shizuka, with the unit rebalance a few months ago, Samurai now have the stats to justify the cost, more or less, and Shizuka is the best of the bunch. She's a mid-map sweeper for anti-rushing and has decent bulk to take a hit or two. Worth a look, especially as a cheaper alternative to Elva (bulk is comparable until Elva's Paladin class AW buff at 50% HP kicks in; slower attacks but hits 2 at once; heals self instead of attacking faster in terms of skill)

I guess it fits pretty well that shizuka also increases the ATK of Saki (which i just recrently got and since shes my first and only black, have like 30 spirits for her). So if AWing Saki i should propably AW Shizuka first. An interesting thought could also be Kojuro the male gold samurai... idk. He boosts all Samurais defence by 5% so hed also boost shizuka and vice versa with my sherry+shizuka+himself AW he would gain 5%hp, 10%def and 12% more Atk. I just dont know if thats worth the investment. I guess he would still fall behind mehlis or zola. Belinda might be an option too i guess, since i have no yuyu(one of the only golds im lacking) or any other witch then Cloris she propably doesnt stand as high as usual on the list. I was also thinking about investing into Emilia since i have realy no ramp unit atm (besides Elaine) and who knows when next subjugation hits, her hp in terms of another lightning rod are actualy pretty much the same as kerrys and just baaarely lower then themis hers too. Kerry would be boosted by sherry though.

[soranokira]

Shizuka should be pretty good because she has fairly good stats to perform as offtank/sweeper (500+ def and sufficient hp post-AW). she should be the only samurai you bother about if you have her.

Anemone is a possible choice for magic fencer since you don't have better alternatives, though she should be low priority since you're probably better off leveling and AWing other units first (looking at saki, belinda, lucile and other maxed but not AW'd units)

[IvanLedah21]

Since i started after horace event, i guess... at least i have Anemone for that job?
Im more or less asking about what i lack so i know what i should hope for to cross my way :D And also to know if i need to invest in the gold version of that class or just waste my resources.



I guess it fits pretty well that shizuka also increases the ATK of Saki (which i just recrently got and since shes my first and only black, have like 30 spirits for her). So if AWing Saki i should propably AW Shizuka first. An interesting thought could also be Kojuro the male gold samurai... idk. He boosts all Samurais defence by 5% so hed also boost shizuka and vice versa with my sherry+shizuka+himself AW he would gain 5%hp, 10%def and 12% more Atk. I just dont know if thats worth the investment. I guess he would still fall behind mehlis or zola. Belinda might be an option too i guess, since i have no yuyu(one of the only golds im lacking) or any other witch then Cloris she propably doesnt stand as high as usual on the list. I was also thinking about investing into Emilia since i have realy no ramp unit atm (besides Elaine) and who knows when next subjugation hits, her hp in terms of another lightning rod are actualy pretty much the same as kerrys and just baaarely lower then themis hers too. Kerry would be boosted by sherry though.

Kojuro is a waste if you have Shizuka (actually, he's generally a waste period), but Saki and Shizuka synergize pretty well. Belinda is a good idea as well, and as previously stated Zola is good too, with Mehlis a reasonable option. Anemone is decent but she's way down on the list, and I wouldn't worry about a magic ranged melee right now since Magic Kingdom seems to be a LONG way away (considering we still haven't gotten the 2nd half of Eastern Kingdom). Emilia is a decent UP ramp though I'd probably go Kerry (cheaper being Gold, gets boost from AW Sherry, and her stats aren't semi-gimped due to having Holy Awakening as skill)

I'd look at an order like this:
Saki > Shizuka > Zola/Belinda (AoE vs. Witch) > Kerry > Mehlis > Anemone (if you don't draw Sabinne or OMG Sybilla or have access to Horace revival by this point)

[Nero010]

Man, how much i wish id get sybilla... shes my fav, look and art wise, and pretty much one of the reason i sticked with this game the first few days once i saw her. I yolo´ed two summons just for the very very very low chance i get supreme luck drawing her. Well i got Shizuka instat, that is lucky too. And her art is one of my favs also. Just sad she got no AW art.
Only thing which helds Emelia against Kerry is that my Emilia is min cost, skill 4/5 and my Kerry max cost so cced Emilia is at 10 UP, Kerry at 13 UP. Kerry would be cheaper to rise though. I hate this decision lol

[lolix]

Shizuka should be pretty good because she has fairly good stats to perform as offtank/sweeper (500+ def and sufficient hp post-AW). she should be the only samurai you bother about if you have her.

I actually have (and quite like) chizuru. I honestly think that shes one of the better samurais , since , whiel still a samurai (and therefore sitautional) , she is really good when her niche apears

[IvanLedah21]

I actually have (and quite like) chizuru. I honestly think that shes one of the better samurais , since , whiel still a samurai (and therefore sitautional) , she is really good when her niche apears

Looking at the Wiki, if it's accurate, Chizuru has absurdly high HP for her cost and rarity (AW80 is 3607, compared to Shizuka's AW90 2539, Sakuya's AW90 3347 and Akane's AW90 3143) and her attack is higher than the platinum Samurai (AW80 783 compared to Shizuka AW90 751, Sakuya's 643/1222 and Akane's 736). On the other hand that HP is probably to make up for her crap defense (AW 80 239 Defense with 3 blocks; Shizuka has 578 at AW90, Sakuya 520 and Akane has 499) and the fact her skill is iffy (Shizuka heals herself, Akane has flat 50% dodge, Sakuya's is Attack Increase 4, while Chizuru gets 80% dodge against ranged, but also draws ranged attacks to herself which might attract extra attacks if you dropped someone after her, plus it doesn't do anything against melee)

Cost-wise, Sakuya and Shizuka are 26->23, Akane is 27->23 and Chizuru is 23 -> 20, so she has an edge there. Just a matter of whether her HP is enough survival with her crap defense + 3 blocks. Her niche is clearing light mobs, and she certainly does it well with her high HP, Attack and lower cost, plus attacking 3 at once, just get her out before the heavy hitters come.

[Nero010]

Its very likely though that i will pretty much never use Shizuka AND Chizuru in one map though, right? And i guess if i had to choose between them i pick Shizuka who also buffs herself (putting her above Chizuru in Attack again). If i need lots of HP i have Imelia AND min cost Lolonne. And pretty much every Archer duo or Assassin (which would be the least UP cost version and the most underrated) can deal with early rushes pretty quick cant they?

[IvanLedah21]

Its very likely though that i will pretty much never use Shizuka AND Chizuru in one map though, right? And i guess if i had to choose between them i pick Shizuka who also buffs herself (putting her above Chizuru in Attack again). If i need lots of HP i have Imelia AND min cost Lolonne. And pretty much every Archer duo or Assassin (which would be the least UP cost version and the most underrated) can deal with early rushes pretty quick cant they?

Don't get me wrong, I was just analyzing raw stat gaps between the samurai. I'd take Shizuka over Chizuru almost any day (lower defense but higher HP makes healing incoming damage more difficult and the HP bars deceptive). Early rushes are generally handled by Archers/Witches + Soldiers, possibly a rogue if you're not sure you can kill quick enough and want to gamble (I believe Castle Retake has a Cypria-reliant strategy for underleveled players looking to rush to Dragon Hunting/Flame Dragon, as an example of this), Samurai are a mid-map anti-rush mob clearer class, and while Chizuru's cost is lower than other samurai, it isn't low enough to be viable for early rushes in most cases.

[Nero010]

Yeah... I used that Cypria-reliant strategy back then xD i was still suprised when i had to throw her in as an emergency "token" cause i just barely had what it took (one eastern map for example) how ... well ... she performs even at none cc just lvl 50 without relaying on her skill at all. One day i will raise her and use her just for the interest. Not now. But one day. Idk why but i wanna break this anti rouge meta open D: xD

btw. I have 10 Rainbowspirits and rarely ever used some. Looking at the units I have (knowing this might be a more complex question) whos skill should i start to level or focus into? (Also considering maaaaaybe future S.AW). I came up with that question as Shizukas skill is one that needs to be leveled to reach its "great potential" of a free plat level healer to herself but can only be leveled via Rainbows (most likely).

[IvanLedah21]

Yeah... I used that Cypria-reliant strategy back then xD i was still suprised when i had to throw her in as an emergency "token" cause i just barely had what it took (one eastern map for example) how ... well ... she performs even at none cc just lvl 50 without relaying on her skill at all. One day i will raise her and use her just for the interest. Not now. But one day. Idk why but i wanna break this anti rouge meta open D: xD

btw. I have 10 Rainbowspirits and rarely ever used some. Looking at the units I have (knowing this might be a more complex question) whos skill should i start to level or focus into? (Also considering maaaaaybe future S.AW). I came up with that question as Shizukas skill is one that needs to be leveled to reach its "great potential" of a free plat level healer to herself but can only be leveled via Rainbows (most likely).

Rogues are generally bad outside of Cypria and Berna due to insufficient stats resulting in RNG reliance. Cypria and Berna at least have stats to be decent duelists even without Assassinate (against moderate hitters Cypria does get dodge-reliant somewhat, Berna is surprisingly tough for her cost due to HP + Defense affection and high stats due to Black rarity).

For rainbow spirits, top 2 picks of what you've got are Shizuka and Sherry.

Shizuka's skill when leveled is worthy of calling a "pocket healer" (15% of max HP per hit is ~380 HP per hit at max level, about 50CC50 max affection Alissa healing every 1.2 seconds or something like that for 10 seconds every 25 seconds without the extra deploy slot; might not sound THAT great, but it is if heal slots aren't readily available nearby, or even if they are it's extra healing if "burst healing" is needed for her)

Sherry is your primary duelist and she attacks magically, but she does have some issues taking hits against strong enemies, so killing them in 2-3 hits is good.

Spica's skill is great but I'd refrain from using rainbows on her due to extra copies being available from TP and Lauren the silver archer sharing her skill meaning when he's farmable you can possibly get a skill up or two there.

[SabishiiRyuu]

General consensus is that if you're gonna use a samurai, use Shizuka. She's definitely a good tank-substitute as someone already said, not to mention her SAW turns her into a god tier duelist.

Don't listen to haters! Never regret leveling the honorable samurai army:

http://i.imgur.com/0WlpCsD.png

[buttlover]

Only reason why they didn't give shizuku as much hp is because she is already OP enough as it is.

She can pretty much be fielded solo without a healer if get your timing down.

High attk+3 blocks+cleave+"life steal"

[Unregistered]

Chizuru seems too niche as Nero pointed out, almost any time you'd want her anything else would suffice for early rushes. Her utility as cheap, strong lighting rod who can avoid magic attacks with her skill though is probably very awesome on some maps.

As to Ivan's point, I'd say Kojuro is far from useless exactly because he has Shizuka. Once she's leveled, if you find you are getting good use out of her then I think eventually AWing Kojuro would be a very good move because of synergizing AW buffs. Kojuro on his own already has the stats of a great offtank as well (Increase Def IV let's not forget). You rarely need the raw def of two heavies, so Bernice and Kojuro are my two main blockers for most maps. He's also great help on male only maps, let me beat Toast to Men G with no buffs and without the real premiums like Gellius and Jerome. Because you have Shizuka, you'd be AWing Kojuro almost only for the buff (and male maps) so I'd put most of your premium team ahead in priority but definitely something to think about when you have extra DCs an silvers for it.

As to rainbows, I'd just save them as long as space permits until you need them for a particular map due to how few you receive as a non-whale. Priorities may change a lot if we get SAW ahead of schedule or some weird map comes out so I always prefer to have enough banked to likely max a premium skill when I need it. As said though, you can't really go wrong with skills like Sherry and Shizuka though.

[lolix]

Looking at the Wiki, if it's accurate, Chizuru has absurdly high HP for her cost and rarity (AW80 is 3607, compared to Shizuka's AW90 2539, Sakuya's AW90 3347 and Akane's AW90 3143) and her attack is higher than the platinum Samurai (AW80 783 compared to Shizuka AW90 751, Sakuya's 643/1222 and Akane's 736). On the other hand that HP is probably to make up for her crap defense (AW 80 239 Defense with 3 blocks; Shizuka has 578 at AW90, Sakuya 520 and Akane has 499) and the fact her skill is iffy (Shizuka heals herself, Akane has flat 50% dodge, Sakuya's is Attack Increase 4, while Chizuru gets 80% dodge against ranged, but also draws ranged attacks to herself which might attract extra attacks if you dropped someone after her, plus it doesn't do anything against melee)

Cost-wise, Sakuya and Shizuka are 26->23, Akane is 27->23 and Chizuru is 23 -> 20, so she has an edge there. Just a matter of whether her HP is enough survival with her crap defense + 3 blocks. Her niche is clearing light mobs, and she certainly does it well with her high HP, Attack and lower cost, plus attacking 3 at once, just get her out before the heavy hitters come.





As her stats indicate , chizuru is made as either a lightning rod because she forces enemy ranged attacks on her or for fighting mages and liches (high hp , low defenswe - doesn't matter to magic attacks , and as far as i know , the only skill in the game that allows dodging magic damage)


Her effective hp against a lich during her skill usage is over 15k (assuming 20% hit rate).




That's her niche. And she's really good at it. Because of that , and their costs , shizuka and chizuru fill different niches , so comparing them is useless.


Actually , i'd argue that chizuru's niche and ability are more unique then shizuka's (who can easily be replaced by plenty others)

[IvanLedah21]

As her stats indicate , chizuru is made as either a lightning rod because she forces enemy ranged attacks on her or for fighting mages and liches (high hp , low defenswe - doesn't matter to magic attacks , and as far as i know , the only skill in the game that allows dodging magic damage)


Her effective hp against a lich during her skill usage is over 15k (assuming 20% hit rate).




That's her niche. And she's really good at it. Because of that , and their costs , shizuka and chizuru fill different niches , so comparing them is useless.


Actually , i'd argue that chizuru's niche and ability are more unique then shizuka's (who can easily be replaced by plenty others)

So Chizuru's works against magic? OK then, that does give her a clear niche distinctly different from her fellow samurai (still RNG reliant but 80% is pretty good) and she's much more readily accessible (as much as a premium unit can be) than most of the better lightning rods (Sophie, Sybilla, Dahlia, Clissa, etc.) so that gives her added value

@Unregistered: Kojuro isn't useless if you're using Samurai, and he is a decent off-tank/bulky dps, but in general you aren't going to use him if you have Shizuka due to UP costs (2 samurai used in same battle is costly) and while AW him for his buff is a decent long-term option, there are a plethora of units ahead of him on the list

[Nero010]

if i were you i won't call kojuro a waste since the biggest whale on dmm uses a mincosted kojuro over hibari. that being said.samurai has little to no application in current nutaku or future.as sad as it is..the event samurai>shizuka practically. because of lr placement. shizuka is just a off tank rush blocker in places where u cant afford or reach a healer with( considering nutaku took like ever to release a priest warrior)..in future role of shizuka? none..all the more defunct after hibari a free black :/...future role for momoji/kojuro..pretty solid..y? momoji is off lr that can kill a blue majin wid buffs nd non aw stats..kojuro can stop rush and is pretty easy to place if min costed :/...provided nutaku gives free gold rushes of him in future :/

So ud say with S.AW giving Shizuka 300% more ATK and DEF and selfhealing (10% instat of 15) and droping her to one block makes her not have a use or puts her as a duelist even above units like sherry? Sure.

[IvanLedah21]

if i were you i won't call kojuro a waste since the biggest whale on dmm uses a mincosted kojuro over hibari. that being said.samurai has little to no application in current nutaku or future.as sad as it is..the event samurai>shizuka practically. because of lr placement. shizuka is just a off tank rush blocker in places where u cant afford or reach a healer with( considering nutaku took like ever to release a priest warrior)..in future role of shizuka? none..all the more defunct after hibari a free black :/...future role for momoji/kojuro..pretty solid..y? momoji is off lr that can kill a blue majin wid buffs nd non aw stats..kojuro can stop rush and is pretty easy to place if min costed :/...provided nutaku gives free gold rushes of him in future :/

Even if all that is true... who knows when Hibari will show up, a free black on Nutaku is a sketchy idea given their track record, Momoji isn't like the other samurai anyways, Kojuro min-costed is a sketchy idea since Nutaku's pace says without whaling you aren't going to get that for about 3 years if that...

As far as Nutaku goes AT PRESENT, not looking at the future of only god knows when, Shizuka totally outclasses Kojuro outside of cost in 95% of situations. Kojuro might have solid status on DMM, but this thread is about Nutaku, where he's an off-tank rush blocker just like Shizuka, with superior HP and during skill, Defense (though she's self-healing to make up for this).

Side Question: what's lr stand for?

[Unregistered]

Because you have Shizuka, you'd be AWing Kojuro almost only for the buff (and male maps) so I'd put most of your premium team ahead in priority but definitely something to think about when you have extra DCs an silvers for it.

@Ivan, I literally said that in my post..the only scenarios where I see it even happening involve withdraw shenanigans and lightning rod use anyway.

[buttlover]

if i were you i won't call kojuro a waste since the biggest whale on dmm uses a mincosted kojuro over hibari.

Wait what. Please don't take what a whale does for fun as a logical point for an argument.
Are you telling me if forced to delete one unit, you'll pick removing hibari over kojuro?

Either way shizuka is a valid pick in nutaku. Hibari isn't ever gonna be released to nutaku within the next 2 years at least.
I am sure, there will be a revival in DMM before nutaku even gets a chance at her. I need her. Q_Q

[Nero010]

I did Update the thread after my last rolling spree. Please look into it!

[lolix]

well grace , fignelia and camilla are the obvious choices. Actually , i'd raise and aw camilla first because shes quite a bit better then her sister (i have one on my main)

Grace is a black , and by that fact alone , she's very strong. On top of that she has a rather powerfull skill and a great AW passive.

As for figelia...well she's a great DPS witch , but that's pretty much it. She's going to hit llike a truck , but i don't see her as a high priority. At least not over the other 2 anyway

[IvanLedah21]

Lolix beat me to it. Camilla is in all honesty probably our best healer (due to Liana being pseudo-nerfed by the lack of her event/UP adjustment to compensate for shift to premium, as well as her niche skill instead of buffing healing output) as she outheals Liana during skill and has way more reasonable UP cost.

Grace is a black, do we really need to go there? :p

I don't use Fignelia due to having raised Adele, Despara and Yuyu, but seems like a solid unit.

[lolix]

to be fair , we also got black Iris/Elise , so she's not our best healer anymore (at least not overall. She IS the best burst healer we have tho.....with the second best probably being shiho during skill usage , or chydys - which for some reason we still cant get because nutaku doesnt want us to have older TP post units back....), but she is still one of the best

[IvanLedah21]

to be fair , we also got black Iris/Elise , so she's not our best healer anymore (at least not overall. She IS the best burst healer we have tho.....with the second best probably being shiho during skill usage , or chydys - which for some reason we still cant get because nutaku doesnt want us to have older TP post units back....), but she is still one of the best

Ah right, forgot about Elise, she's new and I don't have her (yet, hopefully ;))

[Nero010]

How about Farne? Isnt she a black too? xD
It seems like shes making beating spirit rescue G and golden armor G a lot easier (and i cant clear them atm)

[lolix]

all blacks are worth leveling by virtue of being black. That generally means great stats and skill on deployment