Kamihime General Discussion + Q&A [Archive] - Page 21

blubbergott

06-21-2018, 09:16 AM

It's really, really difficult for me to say that "Oh yeah, Joan is totally better." If you really need more turns, then Joan WITH BP is bloody amazing though

We were discussing this in context of a fire setup though. All you said is correct, but you disregard the fact that bringing f.e. Sniper Joan over Sniper Mordred will allow you to bring Ares over Raguel and since all you need to do is burn those 2m HP within those 7 turns, the nuking + burst potential of Ares just completely outclass Raguels. This is the reason Joan beats Mordred in such scenarios imo: He does 2 jobs at once. Handling OD and brings the A frame Atk down.

Ofc BP has a lot of uses, the weaker you are, the more often you need it and especially Mordred is still the King of off-ele no matter what. I just don't like disregarding the biggest strength fire has (nuking potential to bypass the difficult parts).

Really though, the only way for either of us to prove our points would be to strip away an Eidolon or two, strip away weapons until you have like... 70% power? And then we're probably roughly around the entry point to AQ4 content. Then you'd just need to record a run with both Joan and a run with BP. But I, at least, am certainly not going to bother.

Or let samdan try both and tell us his thoughts. :)

Slashley

06-21-2018, 10:16 AM

No, we can't. (Starting at 14 mins, apparently the link doesn't jump there for some reason).--You had 43k total power by this point. That's hardly a new player level, by which I mean the time when AQ4 starts being doable. Although your video doesn't comment on how high your Grid is. But based on your HP, around ~30% Defenders from two Defender SSRs, I can assume that it was quite high (or did you upgrade Defenders first?).

Also, you had Sol when AQ was released and you didn't exploit -70% Atk? :sweat:
You also forget that AQ4's threat isn't the boss alone, the only place where BP really matters.Not at all - many mobs from wave1 are really useful to BP. Like the second mob in Wind if you have enough damage to kill two mobs in four turns. A new player probably doesn't, so it's probably better off to not use (as this means that you get less "free turns" when the mobs are just buffing up on a buff that doesn't stack).

In Wind wave2 Wind, Joan can either damage cut the first, small AoE or you can wait to cut the buffed AoE - but not both. And you'll be in trouble if you're not about to kill the mid-boss when the third one is approaching. Again, BP giving you WAY more turns until this soft-limit comes up.

Overall, I'd rather have BP in all AQ content than Joan's damage cut. There are certainly ones where it isn't particularly useful (like Dark wave1 for example), but these ones don't gain anything from damage cut either.

nonsensei

06-21-2018, 10:47 AM

You had 43k total power by this point. That's hardly a new player level, by which I mean the time when AQ4 starts being doable.

Which brings us here..

(not to mention new guys won't deal with AQ4, anyway).

Although your video doesn't comment on how high your Grid is. But based on your HP, around ~30% Defenders from two Defender SSRs, I can assume that it was quite high (or did you upgrade Defenders first?).

Also, you had Sol when AQ was released and you didn't exploit -70% Atk? :sweat:

Heck if I remember... Most things were probably around SL10, I believe, some maybe more as a preparation for Nicholas raid, which I decided to farm back then.
As for the 70% atk debuff... I don't like using such cheesings in my vids. That thing was only alive for a month, anyway.

Not at all - many mobs from wave1 are really useful to BP. Like the second mob in Wind if you have enough damage to kill two mobs in four turns. A new player probably doesn't, so it's probably better off to not use (as this means that you get less "free turns" when the mobs are just buffing up on a buff that doesn't stack).

In Wind wave2 Wind, Joan can either damage cut the first, small AoE or you can wait to cut the buffed AoE - but not both. And you'll be in trouble if you're not about to kill the mid-boss when the third one is approaching. Again, BP giving you WAY more turns until this soft-limit comes up.

Overall, I'd rather have BP in all AQ content than Joan's damage cut. There are certainly ones where it isn't particularly useful (like Dark wave1 for example), but these ones don't gain anything from damage cut either.

That sounds great & all, but where exactly do you find himes to cover for other debuffs as a new guy? Not to mention, Sniper Shot is probably the best idea at the very least against the mobs, since it's AoE, as opposed to any other hero debuff and actually covers 2 debuff (atk/def).

I'm still wondering how we ended up discussing AQ4 stuff if we're talking about a new guy. :think:

blubbergott

06-21-2018, 10:57 AM

Once again considering Joan + Ares vs. Mordred + Raguel

Not at all - many mobs from wave1 are really useful to BP. Like the second mob in Wind if you have enough damage to kill two mobs in four turns. A new player probably doesn't, so it's probably better off to not use (as this means that you get less "free turns" when the mobs are just buffing up on a buff that doesn't stack).

BP buys you one overdrive turn on 1 opponent, Ares nuke does about as much damage as an entire attack turn, making it much easier to kill off the first ones.

In Wind wave2 Wind, Joan can either damage cut the first, small AoE or you can wait to cut the buffed AoE - but not both. And you'll be in trouble if you're not about to kill the mid-boss when the third one is approaching. Again, BP giving you WAY more turns until this soft-limit comes up.

Wind wave 2 has 3 Orbs, so you're just increasing it from 4 turns per OD to 5. Sure it helps, but on the other hand, with joan you have 5% more atk down, which also helps and tbh, if you lack the damage to kill this boss in 8 turns, then you're doomed for wave 3 anyways.

Overall, I'd rather have BP in all AQ content than Joan's damage cut. There are certainly ones where it isn't particularly useful (like Dark wave1 for example), but these ones don't gain anything from damage cut either.

While this on it's own is true, if you can replace Raguel by someone way better, then Joan wins hands down.

Slashley

06-21-2018, 11:57 AM

I'm still wondering how we ended up discussing AQ4 stuff if we're talking about a new guy. :think:Not sure! But people are going to want to do AQ4 ASAP, so it's not like it's entirely unrelated.
BP buys you one overdrive turn on 1 opponent, Ares nuke does about as much damage as an entire attack turn, making it much easier to kill off the first ones.That's true, roughly ~4.6 attacks, though exact number depends on Grid (this is with 80% Assault). Bonus points for Heph who takes this to a whopping ~6.4! And Awakened Ares will hit far, far harder.

However, keep in mind that Ares' nuke goes all over the place. This damage is not to a single enemy, but spread across multiple enemies. This might not matter against Wind wave1 since the mobs are identical, though it depends on are your debuffs AoE or not.
Wind wave 2 has 3 Orbs, so you're just increasing it from 4 turns per OD to 5. Sure it helps, but on the other hand, with joan you have 5% more atk down, which also helps and tbh, if you lack the damage to kill this boss in 8 turns, then you're doomed for wave 3 anyways.I'm... not exactly sold on that doom-say. The amount of damage you can output when you save up your abilities + Full Burst to the start of the wave3 Rage phase is much higher than one might expect. I'm... not entirely sure if failed to meet that DPS check in the midboss also mean automatic loss against the actual boss.

For example, it's fully possible that you absolutely need to use your cooldowns against wave1 AND a full burst, because wave1 is DANGEROUS when you're fighting against 3 mobs with +150% Atk buffs. At best your Atk debuffs taking them down from 250% -> 200%, so hardly even be a notable difference... that's why I fucking HATED Wind AQ as it was such a complete pain in the ass until I got Amaterasu. So anyway - after you're entirely dry from wave1, you then have 8~10 turns to unleash hell on the midboss. 8 turns to Full Burst is... unreliable.

But once you clear the mid-boss, the last boss isn't all that bad. Unless you're fighting with elemental DISadvantage, the damage output of the boss isn't particularly threatening. You do need a fair amount DPS to clear the rage phase, but it's certainly not that bad assuming you can get a clean transition off. Hell, I used to let BP expire from the boss just to that I could better control transitions. It took me easily 15-20 turns to hit Rage, and yet I cleared Rage in time, at most eating one Overdrive.

Shieun

06-21-2018, 12:06 PM

Ares also have the ability to burst by turn 4 if you get the RNG right.

BP stops being relevant for AQ4 when you have reached certain grid level. You'd prefer for boss to OD earlier because you can do a lot of damage to push boss to rage in 3 turn, so eating non rage OD is the better option than rage OD.

What often overlooked is that Joan also has a DA buff that have a quite decent proc rate.

At the end of the day, whether you run Joan + Ares or Modred + Raquel depends on who you have for next 2 slots and where your grid is currently at. Do I have enough damage to not need BP so I can run all SSR lineup to maximise my burst damage? Do I not have enough damage that I need BP to reduce how often I take overdrive?

Team building is often regarded as simple exercise. It's probably not as simple as many people would've liked.

blubbergott

06-21-2018, 12:32 PM

I'm still wondering how we ended up discussing AQ4 stuff if we're talking about a new guy. :think:

A "new guy" with all but 2 souls. :)

nonsensei

06-21-2018, 12:51 PM

Then why is 40k+ total power so unimaginable, I wonder. :think:

On a side note, this is getting unnecessarily long, like numerous discussions I've seen in this thread. Maybe it's just me not being used to forum discussion, tho.

Slashley

06-21-2018, 04:32 PM

A "new guy" with all but 2 souls. :)It is possible, many people play the game very casually. Even if you've played the game from the start, if you've never maxed a single SSR and haven't bothered at all with the game mechanics, you're still quite... new.

HugMeTender

06-21-2018, 09:06 PM

Is it worth attempting to farm multiple MLB of the Raid Shop weapons? I mean, I understand the amount of time that entails, but is it even worth a second thought?

Shieun

06-21-2018, 09:24 PM

depends...

If it's for tiamat bow/tiamat herself, definitely yes.

If its for amaru/amaru's sword, maybe not

HugMeTender

06-21-2018, 09:26 PM

depends...

If it's for tiamat bow/tiamat herself, definitely yes.

If its for amaru/amaru's sword, maybe notRaid shop, as in the Soul Skills weapons obtained by exchanging the elemental raid Ragnarok items.

Aidoru

06-21-2018, 09:59 PM

Raid shop, as in the Soul Skills weapons obtained by exchanging the elemental raid Ragnarok items.

Yes but only specific ones. Of the current ones, the only one that really matters is the thunder Charles Blaster gun for D'art as thunder teams are lacking in debuff and she alone with the gun can basically solve that. Many players will most likely opt for Hercule's ax for most other teams when it comes out because it's one of the best. Til then, just hoard the mats needed.

SlickFenix

06-21-2018, 10:29 PM

Yes, Hoarding is good. Hopefully we get a new one after this maintenance so I can start hoarding other element fragments and Regalia

HugMeTender

06-21-2018, 10:52 PM

Yes but only specific ones. Of the current ones, the only one that really matters is the thunder Charles Blaster gun for D'art as thunder teams are lacking in debuff and she alone with the gun can basically solve that. Many players will most likely opt for Hercule's ax for most other teams when it comes out because it's one of the best. Til then, just hoard the mats needed.That's actually the one I want the most of. Right now my Thunder team (with Awakened Sol) is by far my best be use of my weapons.

Cobblemaniac

06-21-2018, 10:54 PM

That's actually the one I want the most of. Right now my Thunder team (with Awakened Sol) is by far my best be use of my weapons.

Thunder with Sol kind of defeats the current purpose of thunder doesn't it? :think:

SlickFenix

06-21-2018, 11:00 PM

Some people just don't have the grid or the right girls to go full ham on Thunder. I know it's hard for me to give up healing.

Delete

06-21-2018, 11:54 PM

Game is up. And we have a new Catastrophe...Water. Who know how many time we will have to wait for Fire.:neutral:

Aidoru

06-22-2018, 12:08 AM

Only took a quick glance before I head to bed but it seems they added multiple soul weapons too. Didn't check names but I think everything but Shingen's and Morgan's? Excluding the element for what we don't have yet but they're there.

Cobblemaniac

06-22-2018, 12:21 AM

Game is up. And we have a new Catastrophe...Water. Who know how many time we will have to wait for Fire.:neutral:

POGGERS

Nutaku going hipster against DMM with that schedule lmao.

Delete

06-22-2018, 12:29 AM

Hercules weapons are on the shop :cool:

Edit: well, Hercules, and all the others save for Shingen and Morgan

Cobblemaniac

06-22-2018, 12:44 AM

Hercules weapons are on the shop :cool:

KEY NOTE: Hercules' weapon does not have burst effect.

Nutaku might seriously be on the cucking road now...

Delete

06-22-2018, 12:47 AM

The burst effect begins with 2 copies, not? :think:

Cobblemaniac

06-22-2018, 12:48 AM

The burst effect begins with 2 copies, not? :think:

... which is something I ain't aware of. The UI doesn't make mention of it. :think:

MagicSpice

06-22-2018, 12:51 AM

i'm actually wondering if i should go for these weapons now that there's a good variety....

my wind team uses joan/gaia combo a lot (and it's my 2nd preferred team).... while my thunder and water teams need some major boosts. probably thunder more since i KNOW i can clear that catastrophe fight (considering i use gaia awk, SSR cybele, and cu chulainn... that's a good start. ithaqua can heal for me too)

Thunder with Sol kind of defeats the current purpose of thunder doesn't it? :think:

thunder doesn't really have healers though either... you'd likely need andromeda or cassiopeia as the soul you use

hell, i might go that route, especially since i already lv capped awakened sol

plus, i though it was fire that was supposed to go ham and be the damage nukers that forgo healing

Slashley

06-22-2018, 12:57 AM

The burst effect begins with 2 copies, not? :think:Correct. -10% Def (Eidolon frame) starting from 1-star, -25% Def (Eidolon frame) starting at LMB.

Also, hooooly shit we actually got Hercules weapons!

Mirage

06-22-2018, 01:01 AM

Correct. -10% Def (Eidolon frame) starting from 1-star

It's 15%, then go up 5% with each LB

Cobblemaniac

06-22-2018, 01:07 AM

New content just keep coming

and they don't stop coming and they don't stop coming and they don't stop coming

Er ok jokes aside.

Any idea what the new ragna login rewards do? Specifically the time staff thing, and what looks like a new eidolon at the end of 12 days. Certainly not expecting much, but is interesting to see.

Kureru

06-22-2018, 01:14 AM

Looks like Demeter's release weapon

http://xn--hckqz0e9cygq471ahu9b.xn--wiki-4i9hs14f.com/index.php?%E6%99%82%E7%AF%80%E6%9D%96%E3%83%86%E3% 82%B9%E3%83%A2%E3%83%9D%E3%83%AA%E3%82%A2

But then the last reward looks like Demeter so I dunno what's up with that.

Slashley

06-22-2018, 01:30 AM

It's 15%, then go up 5% with each LBOh, so it is. I wonder where I got that from, then...
Looks like Demeter's release weapon

http://xn--hckqz0e9cygq471ahu9b.xn--wiki-4i9hs14f.com/index.php?%E6%99%82%E7%AF%80%E6%9D%96%E3%83%86%E3% 82%B9%E3%83%A2%E3%83%9D%E3%83%AA%E3%82%A2

But then the last reward looks like Demeter so I dunno what's up with that.Douuuuble Demeter dude... what could it mean!

Dunhere

06-22-2018, 06:30 AM

Takes 2 copies for the level 40 scene for an SR, doesn't it?

BlazeAlter

06-22-2018, 06:45 AM

Takes 2 copies for the level 40 scene for an SR, doesn't it?

Demeter isn't an eido tho. She's just a free light healer SR hime

FreeToPay

06-22-2018, 08:31 PM

Are the Andromeda weapons worth getting?

Aidoru

06-22-2018, 09:31 PM

I can't believe I had completely forgotten Hades got her awakening.

MagicSpice

06-22-2018, 09:53 PM

I can't believe I had completely forgotten Hades got her awakening.

how when it's advertised with the drag eye shard gacha

(I might just call it the DES gacha or shard gacha for short)

SlickFenix

06-22-2018, 10:32 PM

how when it's advertised with the drag eye shard gacha

(I might just call it the DES gacha or shard gacha for short)

He must play with his eyes closed... :silly:

Aidoru

06-22-2018, 10:44 PM

Because everyone's been focused on soul weapons, water cata and the event so there's been no talk of her. Been running ultimates all day since this is most likely my only free day.

I don't often look at the gacha since I haven't bought any gacha for this game since Thanatos' release. Even if I did need to use it, I usually just double tap the down arrow which skips the 2nd page which her promo is located, to get to gem gacha.

Ikki

06-22-2018, 11:07 PM

to get to gem gacha.

I see you are a man of culture as well

Unregistered

06-23-2018, 12:14 AM

SlickFenix

06-23-2018, 12:24 AM

I keep seeing those round compass-like red things drop during battle. Aren't those supposed to be star coins dropping from the enemies? Yet my star coin count remains at 0. Am I wrong about what those are?

Those are actually clocks, and they reduce the Cool Down period of your main Eidolon.

Star coins are purchased with Nutaku Gold, which in turn is purchased with real money. So unless you want to spend some real money on the game you won't get any star coins. Just have to patiently wait for Magic Jewels.

Slashley

06-23-2018, 12:50 AM

Are the Andromeda weapons worth getting?Not really. If in doubt, just get Herc weapon.

And, weaponS? Aside from Dartagnan's HP weapon, stay away from them. Just stick to the elemental Atk ones - they're just too damn good to pass up on. So if you feel like there's absolutely an element that you absolutely must have Andromeda for some reason, just get the offensive one. But chances are you'll need to farm the Herc weapon later.

MagicSpice

06-23-2018, 12:54 AM

So if you feel like there's absolutely an element that you absolutely must have Andromeda for some reason, just get the offensive one.

-cough- thunder -cough-

(no seriously, thunder doesn't get potent healers for a long while so if there's someone without Sol, it might be worth considering if you can't live off something like the regen ex skills)

Ikki

06-23-2018, 01:01 AM

-cough- thunder -cough-

(no seriously, thunder doesn't get potent healers for a long while so if there's someone without Sol, it might be worth considering if you can't live off something like the regen ex skills)

thunder runs with d'art hp weapon, not andro, slashley mentioned it in the same post you quoted actually.

MagicSpice

06-23-2018, 01:06 AM

thunder runs with d'art hp weapon, not andro, slashley mentioned it in the same post you quoted actually.

any D'art use tends to run with that weapon...

last i seen, her 30% debuffing comes from the HP ones (and you really would need a lot of HP to survive without a healer or with minimal healing).

not saying to prioritize andromeda's weapon over D'Art/Herc, but it's not a bad idea to get her weapon for when you lack a healer. if someone has Sol, then forget about andromeda's catastrophe weapons entirely as Sol should be enough to cover that spot until 2019 when thunder finally gets a really good healer...

it's more "get it at some point if you need it", not "get it ASAP"

Ikki

06-23-2018, 01:08 AM

any D'art use tends to run with that weapon...

last i seen, her 30% debuffing comes from the HP ones (and you really would need a lot of HP to survive without a healer or with minimal healing).

not saying to prioritize andromeda's weapon over D'Art/Herc, but it's not a bad idea to get her weapon for when you lack a healer. if someone has Sol, then forget about andromeda's catastrophe weapons entirely as Sol should be enough to cover that spot until 2019 when thunder finally gets a really good healer...

Thunder doesnt need a healer atm, you just need a good grid, and sol on thunder is situational (when you need her dispel and cleanse, the heal is a bonus), people make the mistake of getting used to her (getting used to healing actually, screwing your dmg output by yourself).

MagicSpice

06-23-2018, 01:15 AM

Thunder doesnt need a healer atm, you just need a good grid, and sol on thunder is situational (when you need her dispel and cleanse, the heal is a bonus), people make the mistake of getting used to her (getting used to healing actually, screwing your dmg output by yourself).

same could be said about fire really, but even then, the "leeroy jenkins" strategy only goes but so far. it's honestly why my fire team has failed a few times... dishing out 50k-70k a hit but getting killed cause the damage they take is at least 1/3rd of their HP even with 40% atk down debuffing they simply lack the HP to survive or the healing gets outdamaged

but in those cases, that's where joan to tank and give slight healing could help (or perun if you wanna go that route for thunder). heck, the ult catastrophes are starting to show that damage isn't everything and it only solves most of the challenge

best damage doesn't make the best grids/teams, it's a mix of damage and survivability.

Ikki

06-23-2018, 01:19 AM

same could be said about fire really, but even then, the "leeroy jenkins" strategy only goes but so far. it's honestly why my fire team has failed a few times... dishing out 50k-70k a hit but getting killed cause the damage they take is at least 1/3rd of their HP even with 40% atk down debuffing they simply lack the HP to survive or the healing gets outdamaged

but in those cases, that's where joan to tank and give slight healing could help (or perun if you wanna go that route for thunder). heck, the ult catastrophes are starting to show that damage isn't everything and it only solves most of the challenge

best damage doesn't make the best grids/teams, it's a mix of damage and survivability.

In your case its a grid problem cause most veterans i know can solo every single content of the game (including this water rag) without any issues and without healers, and about "the "leeroy jenkins" strategy only goes but so far" its quite the opposite, healing can only get you so far, you wont be able to outsustain most content, the game isnt designed like that and in dmm its even more dmg oriented than before, the sustain/defensive mentality you and a lot of people have is heavily punished in the future and even now.

MagicSpice

06-23-2018, 01:31 AM

In your case its a grid problem cause most veterans i know can solo every single content of the game (including this water rag) without any issues and without healers, and about "the "leeroy jenkins" strategy only goes but so far" its quite the opposite, healing can only get you so far, you wont be able to outsustain most content, the game isnt designed like that and in dmm its even more dmg oriented than before, the sustain/defensive mentality you and a lot of people have is heavily punished in the future and even now.

which is why is said "a mix of damage and survivability"

no matter how you look at it, it still boils down to these two things:

-can you deal enough damage to the boss?
-can you survive attacks from the boss?

in my case, it could be a grid issue, but not in the form of damage (again, 50k-70k damage PER HIT... that's quite a lot per round). it'd be in the form of HP.

every single team thrives on this to some point... it might be 50% damage and 50% suvivability for some cases, it could be 99% damage and 1% suvivability in others... but can never forgo survivability entirely for the harder content unless you're packing something quite strong like 120%-130% assault and double 100% eidolon or something... (even then, most players have access to 40%-60% eidolons anyway)

and keep in mind that while some players have made it to points where they can solo even the catastrophes, not everyone has gotten there the same way. in the process of building your way to that point, your tools might be different. in my case, i don't have amaterasu (she'd be a big help) or summer sol, so it's either bryhildr on her own, or with help from sakuya for the most part for my fire team, and that's if i can even debuff (wind ult gives huge middle finger to debuffers). it may not be a case of healing for them, but for 7-8k HP to get shredded through is kinda ridiculous.. especially since that tends to be the range people stop getting defenders if they even have them

my point is, this game is about strategy. maybe the kill it before it kills you thing can work at times, but for some cases, it doesn't

nonsensei

06-23-2018, 01:46 AM

MagicSpice

06-23-2018, 01:53 AM

I agree with Ikki here. In your case, it's definitely a grid issue if your hp gets depleted so easily. Ideally, you're supposed to have 10k+ hp on every team at this point to safely clear content or at least around 10k. Healing won't get you anywhere if the boss decides to nuke your himes down with 1 hit, higher hp on the other hand will. And so will more damage since the boss dies faster & has fewer chances to actually do as described before.

i did say i might need more defenders on my fire grid, but from what ikki was saying, i pretty much took it as "get more damage cause suvivability gets punished now", cause this was said here:

most veterans i know can solo every single content of the game (including this water rag) without any issues and without healers, and about "the "leeroy jenkins" strategy only goes but so far" its quite the opposite, healing can only get you so far, you wont be able to outsustain most content, the game isnt designed like that and in dmm its even more dmg oriented than before, the sustain/defensive mentality you and a lot of people have is heavily punished in the future and even now.

and again, i never said "outsustain your opponent", i said "you need damage and survivability"

Ikki

06-23-2018, 01:57 AM

and again, i never said "outsustain your opponent", i said "you need damage and survivability"

Well for starters not having enough hp is a grid problem, so nothing wrong with what i said there XD and about the outsustain part i said it cause you overate healers too much, they are just a step up, not your goal, keep that in mind.

nonsensei

06-23-2018, 02:04 AM

i did say i might need more defenders on my fire grid, but from what ikki was saying, i pretty much took it as "get more damage cause suvivability gets punished now", cause this was said here:

It's not exactly wrong, tho. Just think about that bosses usually got 2 orbs. You need quite the damage to get her out of rage coz if you don't, she will keep spamming rage burst every 2nd turn. And most rage bursts aren't really something that you want to keep getting right into the face.
Let's just leave the rag soloing aside coz the arguement that there's no need to solo it - while debatable in some cases - is valid. But think about the AQ4 boss for example. You simply can't outheal her rage burst & her rage meter is pretty big, so you need to dish out enough damage to stun her in pretty limited time. And you also need hp to avoid getting one-shot by those coz losing 3 himes each burst isn't funny. Alternatively, think about the current advent rag: if you can't beat her in several turns, you're as dead as a nit 'cause holy hell, those bursts.

MagicSpice

06-23-2018, 02:06 AM

Well for starters not having enough hp is a grid problem, so nothing wrong with what i said there XD and about the outsustain part i said it cause you overate healers too much, they are just a step up, not your goal, keep that in mind.

current hardest content needs some form of healing, even if it's something like joan's HP regen (which is how my thunder team is still doing okay).

i'm not making healing a top priority (i did say D'art and herc's weapons are better, which they clearly are), but little to no healing is a very quick way to die unless you have really high stats and some insane assault/elem damage values, which is why fire and thunder tend to be damage race teams.

if healing was really a priority, i'd get andromeda with regen, toss in sol, and find a friend ygg to use with my own.... that's not the case nor was how i tried to make things seem. what i was simply saying is that healing/tanking (in other words, survivability) shouldn't be overlooked

hell, it's why i'm not looking forward to the light ult rag, even though i JUST got osiris... that boss is pretty much one mode change the whole fight so you're gonna get nuked a lot (plus i recall it having at least 30 mil HP). and since light is my main team, i'm going after regalia like crazy for that

It's not exactly wrong, tho. Just think about that bosses usually got 2 orbs. You need quite the damage to get her out of rage coz if you don't, she will keep spamming rage burst every 2nd turn. And most rage bursts aren't really something that you want to keep getting right into the face.
Let's just leave the rag soloing aside coz the arguement that there's no need to solo it - while debatable in some cases - is valid. But think about the AQ4 boss for example. You simply can't outheal her rage burst & her rage meter is pretty big, so you need to dish out enough damage to stun her in pretty limited time. And you also need hp to avoid getting one-shot by those coz losing 3 himes each burst isn't funny. Alternatively, think about the current advent rag: if you can't beat her in several turns, you're as dead as a nit 'cause holy hell, those bursts.

inb4 more bosses pull that one gimmack (it was either Vritra or Rahab) and nuke you non-stop cause they have only 1 orb

BlazeAlter

06-23-2018, 06:48 AM

Sora

06-23-2018, 11:44 AM

just got my awakened Hades to level 75 and finished the advent already lol
gotta say, i like her new sprite, she looks great
10555

And I have been deceived by google translate again, I thought death spear turns AoE once she reaches level 75 but apparently not
10556
it does get that combo atk rate down added though, which is pretty nice

I am more jealous about your Dark Loli Pluto... :p
Still need to replace Beelze... (hopefully I have more luck with Chernobog...)
10557

Already finished? How many HE did you use?

BlazeAlter

06-23-2018, 11:52 AM

I am more jealous about your Pluto... :p
Still need to replace Beelze...
10557

Already finished? How many HE did you use?

Hang in there boi, just some more weeks to go till the next miracle ticket~

I honestly lost count... uh I think I had around 150-160ish, then add the 20 from the shop and.. 9 more from the event dailies?
I'm left with 103 HEs, but I cleared the shop already
I only consumed this much since I wanted to level Hades fast to 75 and I got too impatient to wait for sunday (might regret doing this later but we get a ton of HEs from events now anyway)

Sora

06-23-2018, 12:02 PM

Hang in there boi, just some more weeks to go till the next miracle ticket~

I honestly lost count... uh I think I had around 150-160ish, then add the 20 from the shop and.. 9 more from the event dailies?
I'm left with 103 HEs, but I cleared the shop already
I only consumed this much since I wanted to level Hades fast to 75 and I got too impatient to wait for sunday (might regret doing this later but we get a ton of HEs from events now anyway)

Yea. August will be nice. Miracle Pluto, if I don't have her till then and awaken Satan finally.
However I hope I can get Pluto before. I have 4 MT options anyway ^^

True, raid events give you enough HE back and gem gatcha too.

BlazeAlter

06-23-2018, 12:08 PM

Yea. August will be nice. Miracle Pluto, if I don't have her till then and awaken Satan finally.

True, raid events give you enough HE back and gem gatcha too.

Then the month after august, Trivia + Chernobog/Anubis release (o boi)
then 2 months waiting for apocalypse reprint lol

yeah its nice, unlike back then it was kinda hard to hoard a lot of half elixirs (I've never gone down 100 yet and I forgot when I even got this much)

Sora

06-23-2018, 12:11 PM

Then the month after august, Trivia + Chernobog/Anubis release (o boi)
then 2 months waiting for apocalypse reprint lol

yeah its nice, unlike back then it was kinda hard to hoard a lot of half elixirs (I've never gone down 100 yet and I forgot when I even got this much)

I'll be happy if I can at least get Chernobog... Then I can switch Osiris/Dark Amaterasu with Chernobog for more damage :D
Yea and I can finally replace my fucking Medusa with Trivia :)

I am happy I started this game with the new gatcha system, haha.

BlazeAlter

06-23-2018, 12:16 PM

I'll be happy if I can at least get Chernobog... Then I can switch Osiris/Dark Amaterasu with Chernobog for more damage :D
Yea and I can finally replace my fucking Medusa with Trivia :)

I am happy I started this game with the new gatcha system, haha.

Guess I'll also start hoarding some jewels... doesn't help that I've been giving in to temptation after winning some weeks ago

and yeah, back then I had to plan out when and where I would spend those elixirs on, and if I remember correctly during advents you can only redeem 3 HEs per day unlike now where u can grab 20 elixirs immediately
nowadays its just spend them on anything I like and want to do lol

Sora

06-23-2018, 12:42 PM

Guess I'll also start hoarding some jewels... doesn't help that I've been giving in to temptation after winning some weeks ago

and yeah, back then I had to plan out when and where I would spend those elixirs on, and if I remember correctly during advents you can only redeem 3 HEs per day unlike now where u can grab 20 elixirs immediately
nowadays its just spend them on anything I like and want to do lol

My experience with saving jews was ... really bad tbh.
Hopefully I have this time a bit more luck^^

BlazeAlter

06-23-2018, 12:44 PM

My experience with saving jews was ... really bad tbh.
Hopefully I have this time a bit more luck^^

well you know
we all weep in the gacha salt
10558
all we can do is wait and hope that our efforts actually get rewarded

Sora

06-23-2018, 12:48 PM

well you know
we all weep in the gacha salt
10558
all we can do is wait and hope that our efforts actually get rewarded

Yea, it's a game for masochist tbh.
Well, I used this week my jews (9k) because I was a bit frustrated and got Sol, lol.
Still nice. Now I need Light Tsuku and my light team is ready. It's always good to have a strong ele adv team for your main element :D

I hope that I can save my jews now xP

BlazeAlter

06-23-2018, 12:52 PM

Yea, it's a game for masochist tbh.
Well, I used this week my jews (9k) because I was a bit frustrated and got Sol, lol.
Still nice. Now I need Light Tsuku and my light team is ready. It's always good to have a strong ele adv team for your main element :D

I hope that I can save my jews now xP

lucky, meanwhile I don't know what I'm even doing and just doing rolls whenever I feel like it lol
I should control myself before I end up with nothing and just salt

Amak

06-23-2018, 01:07 PM

Sora

06-23-2018, 01:17 PM

Mirage

06-23-2018, 01:31 PM

Question. I hear Hercules is considered top dog and her relic weapon a must. I get that she has great nuke and damage, but is she worth using for anything other than damage? I don't have perfect KH teams, so most of the time I need to use Joan or Mordred for utility (except thunder where D'art is life).

There are way more to Herc than just "great nuke and damage", she is:
1. The best in term of damage and survivability, tend to deal the most dmg in your team, and to be the last one standing.
2. 2nd in burst speed, behind only Shingen, can use PF very effectively.
3. Her relic weapon give 15% D Frame Def down on Burst at 1LB, each LB give 5% more.
4. 1 turn CD reduction passive (overlooked by a lot of ppl), great for ultility EX.

Amak

06-23-2018, 01:33 PM

Sora

06-23-2018, 01:37 PM

There are way more to Herc than just "great nuke and damage", she is:
1. The best in term of damage and survivability, tend to deal the most dmg in your team, and to be the last one standing.
2. 2nd in burst speed, behind only Shingen, can use PF very effectively.
3. Her relic weapon give 15% D Frame Def down on Burst at 1LB, each LB give 5% more.
4. 1 turn CD reduction passive (overlooked by a lot of ppl), great for ultility EX.

But Mirage-sensei it also depends what kind of team you have and if you need AoE Def down or not and how fast you can burst with your team :O
My wind team is slow and can only cover AoE-B-Frame def down. Therefore I would go with Hercules.

A dark team with Satan AW, Pluto, Osiris and Chernobog will probably run with Shingen because of snipper as ex.
You can also use Dark Ama/Samael later instead of Osiris/Satan AW and run with Hercules+PF :D

That's the thing, almost every team I have needs at least one debuff covered, so I can't see much use from the pure-damage type souls. So I wonder if in the mean time I should just get the ATK weapon for the souls I actually use.

EDIT: Oh, her weapon burst is def debuff? Now I see what's the deal.

yea and Hercules with Relic weapon burst fast enough, so that you can get your def down even if you only cover -20%def down.
You won't need BP that much later, if you get stronger.

Slashley

06-23-2018, 05:45 PM

That's the thing, almost every team I have needs at least one debuff covered, so I can't see much use from the pure-damage type souls. So I wonder if in the mean time I should just get the ATK weapon for the souls I actually use.

EDIT: Oh, her weapon burst is def debuff? Now I see what's the deal.Yup. Combine the on-burst effect from her Relic weapon and you have a very, very strong Def- on your hands. And you still have a free EX slot. While you'll usually want to use it for PF (Herc doesn't even need help from others to reach PF, for crying out loud!), but if you really need to, you can bring something else.

Mirage

06-23-2018, 10:05 PM

But Mirage-sensei it also depends what kind of team you have and if you need AoE Def down or not and how fast you can burst with your team :O
My wind team is slow and can only cover AoE-B-Frame def down. Therefore I would go with Hercules.

A dark team with Satan AW, Pluto, Osiris and Chernobog will probably run with Shingen because of snipper as ex.
You can also use Dark Ama/Samael later instead of Osiris/Satan AW and run with Hercules+PF

Which is why i didnt say anythin like "you absolutely must run Herc". She is, like any other, can be better or worse in certain situation, it's just that it is better most of the time.
One thing i forget, is that the def debuff on Herc burst has much higher accuracy than Sniper, Ambush or most debuff ( and it is 25% as well if you can MLB the weapon), so depend on what you want: faster debuff or more reliable, or just want to control your pacing

HugMeTender

06-24-2018, 07:41 AM

Got this from that SSR weapon ticket, thinking of breaking it with that purple brick thing. This is probably the best option since it normally costs 15 eyes right? https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180624/b76fee8904d5f3e006ab2d23eee29e18.jpg

Cobblemaniac

06-24-2018, 07:49 AM

Got this from that SSR weapon ticket, thinking of breaking it with that purple brick thing. This is probably the best option since it normally costs 15 eyes right? huge image

Jesus, I was just gonna get into the topic...

To answer your question first, that's arguably the best use you can get out of your SSR bricks. The only question is whether you actually use that element by then and to what effect. If you still didn't touch that element by then... well there's always the option of going for your hime release weapons. Sol's gun for example, has a pretty rad 4LB.

... and now here's my question. How practical is it to save up 15 eyes for a weapon so you can LB them with the tower reward bricks in the future?

Aidoru

06-24-2018, 07:54 AM

I personally wouldn't use it on any non-event 0 break SSR weapons. Until you get more copies of a SSR weapon, I'd save it.

HugMeTender

06-24-2018, 07:59 AM

Jesus, I was just gonna get into the topic...

To answer your question first, that's arguably the best use you can get out of your SSR bricks. The only question is whether you actually use that element by then and to what effect. If you still didn't touch that element by then... well there's always the option of going for your hime release weapons. Sol's gun for example, has a pretty rad 4LB.

... and now here's my question. How practical is it to save up 15 eyes for a weapon so you can LB them with the tower reward bricks in the future?Sol's gun was my very next choice, but my Thunder team is definitely my strongest element and that SSR axe seems to have high stats.

While light has my very best Hime, Thunder has all my weapons and Eidolon.

blubbergott

06-24-2018, 08:10 AM

Sol's gun was my very next choice, but my Thunder team is definitely my strongest element and that SSR axe seems to have high stats.

Thunder axe will get Exceed and has very good stats. Sol Gun on the other hand gets Ascension (which you can get plenty of from UE staff) and has rather mediocre stats. Thunder axe might be a decent choice, Sol gun would be a complete waste imo.

Slashley

06-24-2018, 08:10 AM

Got this from that SSR weapon ticket, thinking of breaking it with that purple brick thing. This is probably the best option since it normally costs 15 eyes right? Until you can LMB it, don't.

If you can LMB it, go ahead.

Cobblemaniac

06-24-2018, 08:12 AM

Until you can LMB it, don't.

If you can LMB it, go ahead.

Does that mean saving 3 bricks and the mats for the weapon, or does that mean getting 3 more of the same weapon?

HugMeTender

06-24-2018, 08:14 AM

Does that mean saving 3 bricks and the mats for the weapon, or does that mean getting 3 more of the same weapon?I'd say it would mean 3 bricks. Which seems like a self-defeating argument if you're definitely using them on a specific weapon.

Im definitely not farming 450 weeks of shards to MLB this weapon. Especially since eyes have much better uses.

Cobblemaniac

06-24-2018, 08:26 AM

I'd say it would mean 3 bricks. Which seems like a self-defeating argument if you're definitely using them on a specific weapon.

Im definitely not farming 450 weeks of shards to MLB this weapon. Especially since eyes have much better uses.

The other way to interpret is until you find the materials for the 4th LB. In that case...

List of mats:
5 orichalcum (GO drops)
20 wind regalia
20 wind fangs
30 tier 4 stars
15 silver books
10 gold books

Not way too demanding. I think. By the time you get enough bricks from the tower you should have gathered enough mats to 4LB like 3 dragon eye weapons. If you actually have 3 3LB dragon eye weapons that is lol. The irony

I personally wouldn't use it on any non-event 0 break SSR weapons. Until you get more copies of a SSR weapon, I'd save it.

That seems to counter conventional wisdom as far as I'm aware.

Event SSR weapons are in a sense, renewable. At least, the advent and the union ones. Raid ones are obtainable by orichalcum, but they don't even have 4LB so their worth is debatable. Then, we add the fact that they generally have lower stats than gacha/ dragon eye weapons. Why would one spend bricks on those?

... Unless I'm misinterpreting (I'm particularly bad with pronouns lol), as I believe I did Slashley's.

Slashley

06-24-2018, 08:30 AM

-- Im definitely not farming 450 weeks of shards to MLB this weapon.--It's more like 150 weeks since every event gives you 2 Shards now. Also, if you're in a good Union, then you're going to get like 10+ extra Shards per month from UE, taking total time required down to... 7 months or so? And finally, in theory you can get a brick from Tower events, but realistically you won't until the second one (if I've understood how shit works right).

But yes, obviously the FLB stuff for Hime/Dragon Eye weapons are meant for massive whales only. The tiny trickle of "ooo free shiny is cool isn't it!!!!1" is utterly pathetic.
IEspecially since eyes have much better uses.There are?

Well, Awakenings, I guess. But since our Shard income is shooting through the roof and since you won't have all the Awakened Hime anyway (if you did, Dragon Eyes wouldn't be a problem for you)... well, practically speaking Dragon Eyes are not a bottleneck anymore. Or well, soon won't be. Give it a couple of months and everyone should have all of their Awakenable Hime Awakened. They've demolished the Gem barrier with infinite Gem Quests + Gem Gacha, the SSR book barrier starting from this event (Iluyanka) and the Dragon Eye barrier with Union Events.

HugMeTender

06-24-2018, 08:37 AM

It's more like 150 weeks since every event gives you 2 Shards now. Also, if you're in a good Union, then you're going to get like 10+ extra Shards per month from UE, taking total time required down to... 7 months or so? And finally, in theory you can get a brick from Tower events, but realistically you won't until the second one (if I've understood how shit works right).

But yes, obviously the FLB stuff for Hime/Dragon Eye weapons are meant for massive whales only. The tiny trickle of "ooo free shiny is cool isn't it!!!!1" is utterly pathetic.There are?

Well, Awakenings, I guess. But since our Shard income is shooting through the roof and since you won't have all the Awakened Hime anyway (if you did, Dragon Eyes wouldn't be a problem for you)... well, practically speaking Dragon Eyes are not a bottleneck anymore. Or well, soon won't be. Give it a couple of months and everyone should have all of their Awakenable Hime Awakened. They've demolished the Gem barrier with infinite Gem Quests + Gem Gacha, the SSR book barrier starting from this event (Iluyanka) and the Dragon Eye barrier with Union Events.Awakening was one, but the guaranteed SSR ticket seems like a better investment. Breaking Eidolon is great and getting new Hime/Eye+break seems like a much better use of eyes to me.

Or is there only one available ever?

Cobblemaniac

06-24-2018, 08:40 AM

Awakening was one, but the guaranteed SSR ticket seems like a better investment. Breaking Eidolon is great and getting new Hime/Eye+break seems like a much better use of eyes to me.

Or is there only one available ever?

Note, guaranteed SSR ticket DOES NOT guarantee a hime release weapon. Add on the fact that if it's a random eye weapon, it 1. will not necessarily fit your element and 2. will not necessarily give you a dupe to LB, you're really playing with your luck with that one.

Slashley

06-24-2018, 08:55 AM

Awakening was one, but the guaranteed SSR ticket seems like a better investment. Breaking Eidolon is great and getting new Hime/Eye+break seems like a much better use of eyes to me.

Or is there only one available ever?All the Dragon Eye stuff should refresh daily, I think.

Aside from that, I am very confused by your post, though...
"Breaking Eidolon is great"? What? Gacha SSR Eidolons are complete garbage, aside from P2W ones (which you will not realistically pull) and Kaisers. So any investment in this direction seems... terrible.
"guaranteed SSR ticket seems like a better investment"? 50/50 for complete garbage or a random SSR Hime doesn't seem very appealing either. And this is assuming that they removed non-Hime SSR weapons from this one.

There's also the 5 Dragon Eye random non-Hime weapon, which is a gamble as it can give you utter trash like this shit (http://xn--hckqz0e9cygq471ahu9b.xn--wiki-4i9hs14f.com/index.php?%E5%A5%B3%E7%8E%8B%E6%A9%9F%E9%8A%83%E3% 83%9F%E3%83%88%E3%82%A5%E3%83%A0) (Defender/dbl, with a quick glance there was 4/16 chance of garbage), or as Cobble pointed out, you might get something for an element that you don't care about.

So... after Awakening, what is the best way to use your extra Dragon Eyes, which you will eventually start getting now? Not sure, honestly. But I doubt it's the Tickets or the limit break materials, which just leaves the weapons.

HugMeTender

06-24-2018, 12:51 PM

Note, guaranteed SSR ticket DOES NOT guarantee a hime release weapon. Add on the fact that if it's a random eye weapon, it 1. will not necessarily fit your element and 2. will not necessarily give you a dupe to LB, you're really playing with your luck with that one.I know. But my point was that you can make use of basically anything you get from it. Even if it's an element that you're not good with, you can then start building that element. I mean, the ultimate goal is to have everything, right?

If you pull a new Eidolon, it's most likely useful.
If you pull a repeat Eidolon, you can break it.
If you pull a repeat Hime, you get an eye AND break the weapon.
If you get a new Hime, it'll help no matter what (it just depends on how helpful it will be at the time).

I guess there's the chance of someone pulling a MLB copy, but that's ultra bad luck.

HugMeTender

06-24-2018, 01:21 PM

All the Dragon Eye stuff should refresh daily, I think.

Aside from that, I am very confused by your post, though...
"Breaking Eidolon is great"? What? Gacha SSR Eidolons are complete garbage, aside from P2W ones (which you will not realistically pull) and Kaisers. So any investment in this direction seems... terrible.
"guaranteed SSR ticket seems like a better investment"? 50/50 for complete garbage or a random SSR Hime doesn't seem very appealing either. And this is assuming that they removed non-Hime SSR weapons from this one.

There's also the 5 Dragon Eye random non-Hime weapon, which is a gamble as it can give you utter trash like this shit (http://xn--hckqz0e9cygq471ahu9b.xn--wiki-4i9hs14f.com/index.php?%E5%A5%B3%E7%8E%8B%E6%A9%9F%E9%8A%83%E3% 83%9F%E3%83%88%E3%82%A5%E3%83%A0) (Defender/dbl, with a quick glance there was 4/16 chance of garbage), or as Cobble pointed out, you might get something for an element that you don't care about.

So... after Awakening, what is the best way to use your extra Dragon Eyes, which you will eventually start getting now? Not sure, honestly. But I doubt it's the Tickets or the limit break materials, which just leaves the weapons.I mean, I guess.. Though to me it feels like Hime (for a player like me who doesn't have a lot yet) are slightly more important than weapons with Eidolon being at the bottom, and only one of the tickets in question gives Hime.

HugMeTender

06-24-2018, 01:34 PM

Also, with a 1/6 chance of even landing in the element you want, you can still not get the weapon you want even after several pulls.

Even if you had flawless luck, it'd take 360 eyes to MLB every weapon. Without flawless luck, every new MLB you get increases the chances of getting a repeat of said weapon that you MAY or MAY NOT use.

My point is not that one has explicit value over the other, I can just see more silver lining out of the ticket that has even a small chance of a new Hime.

Other than weapons and tickets, we technically have the trails, but lol yeah right.

Aidoru

06-24-2018, 02:00 PM

That seems to counter conventional wisdom as far as I'm aware.

Event SSR weapons are in a sense, renewable. At least, the advent and the union ones. Raid ones are obtainable by orichalcum, but they don't even have 4LB so their worth is debatable. Then, we add the fact that they generally have lower stats than gacha/ dragon eye weapons. Why would one spend bricks on those?

... Unless I'm misinterpreting (I'm particularly bad with pronouns lol), as I believe I did Slashley's.

Yes you are misinterpreting it. I'm saying to spend it only on SSR weapons not from events.

I would not use it on a himeless SSR weapon unless you spend a lot on this game because eyes. While increasing in ways to obtain, they are still a slow to get resource. I've played from launch and I only have gotten a total of 18 completed eyes, some from duplicate SSR draws and currently at 9 because of Sol, Hades and Thor awakening with 2 more to come within the few next months (Satan and Uriel). Unless you can max break limit the SSR himeless weapon with the item, you're better off saving the item and your eyes.

Other than weapons and tickets, we technically have the trails, but lol yeah right.

If you have a 100% eidolon, saving for the eidolon break limit item is also an option, because you have less chance of ever drawing another copy of that while you still have a chance of drawing duplicate copies of gacha SSR weapons, at least hime ones.

MagicSpice

06-24-2018, 10:56 PM

the way i see that big package, it's 21 pulls (one forced to be SSR and you can save the magic jewels) and two break limit items (that normally cost 40 drag eyes together which is FAR more expensive) for 9800 coins... that's honestly not bad, especially considering that hey, you get another batch of magic jewels adding that much....

it's expensive, so not everyone will go for it, but I think it's worth getting for that price and what you get out of it.

and honestly, unless you're like me and have one or two gacha SSR eidolons at MLB status, you aren't get a dud anyway. worst case would be another drag eye in that situation, and those do take a while to make despite events practically handing out 2 each one. for a free player, that's practically 3 a week outside advent events where they can get more (either 3 or 6) and maybe the union fights if they rank high, which means it is a 10 week maximum to awaken a kamihime for the diligent player considering they don't pull more drag eyes

far as i know, i only have gotten about 20-25 drag eyes (with 6 awakened kami) and i've been playing since prelauch (due to that eidolon gacha thing they had). 25 drag eyes in about a year? that's a long time considering that i'm practically a whale...

as for the 3k one, it's to a much lesser extent but still, expensive as fuck item is in the bag... again, 20 drag eyes IS. NOT. CHEAP. and they pretty much give you one for far less than what you'd likely spend for that. assuming the drag eye pull rate is 1.5% (which is the most it'll ever be if you got every SSR Kami weapon), that's pretty much 1 out of every 67 pulls you'll net a drag eye... i would not want to be the poor soul adding money just for the sake of mass pulling drag eyes...

If you have a 100% eidolon, saving for the eidolon break limit item is also an option, because you have less chance of ever drawing another copy of that while you still have a chance of drawing duplicate copies of gacha SSR weapons, at least hime ones.

not just them really, cause the rate of the dragoons doesn't seem too great either...

plus people forget that eidolons like echinda hit 60%. it's around half of what the 100% ones get sure... but that's TWO TEAMS you cover with one... and ones like Behemoth cover THREE. I wouldn't make them break limit priority with those items, but they really shouldn't be counted as "a waste of a pull"

Slashley

06-25-2018, 12:49 AM

the way i see that big package, it's 21 pulls (one forced to be SSR and you can save the magic jewels) and two break limit items (that normally cost 40 drag eyes together which is FAR more expensive) for 9800 coins... that's honestly not bad, especially considering that hey, you get another batch of magic jewels adding that much....

it's expensive, so not everyone will go for it, but I think it's worth getting for that price and what you get out of it.--... let's break that package down before you sucker anyone into buying it.

What you get:
- 60 bucks of "value" in pulls (10 non-rate up, 10 rate up), but these pulls are a complete scam so might as well value them at 0.
- SSR Eidolon limit break which is complete garbage without P2W Eidolons, so only applies to people who have P2W Eidolons (or Kaisers).
- SSR guaranteed ticket which has a 50% chance of giving you complete trash, so ~25 bucks of value going by 50 bucks for guaranteed SSR Hime.
- The SSR weapon limit break material can be really good, I guess.

So we're talking 25-85 bucks of value, depending on how you rate the pulls. If you're not a person who has more money than common sense, then you're not going to value those random pulls. So you're then paying 73 dollars for the weapon Limit Break item. Even if you have a P2W Eidolon (or a Kaiser) for double the value, the 30 bucks just for the weapon Limit Break item is a much better deal, but even then, it's just ONE Limit Break to ONE weapon in ONE element. Sure, reaching a FLB Hime/non-Hime SSR weapon is a fairly big deal, but don't get your hopes up all too much.
-- plus people forget that eidolons like echinda hit 60%. it's around half of what the 100% ones get sure... --Okay, for one, nobody is getting a LMB Echidna without spending thousands and thousands of dollars into the game. And for those people, buying this package is a no-brainer since they'd spend it on the game anyway.

Secondly, 45% elemental is baseline. So Echidna isn't "oooh half of 100% ones!!11", it's "15% compared to 55% gain" over baseline. It's not half, it's not even ONE THIRD of a P2W Eidolon. It's a bit over one-fourth.

Thirdly, you need at least two-star Echidna before she's even worth using over baseline, so exclusive only to those who spend thousands upon thousands of dollars on the game. As such, your point again only applies to people who have more money than common sense.

MagicSpice

06-25-2018, 02:19 AM

Cobblemaniac

06-25-2018, 02:40 AM

except you still need eidolons of matching element later on.... like idk... the light one that's about to get released? This eventually applies to the dark one, which echidna matches on element (and the azathoth i'm sitting on).

otherwise your "100% eidolon" boost only caps at 80%, regardless of break limit. so i don't see a waste in the SSR ticket... and DMM side does have 120% ones for wind and thunder but... same concept when they hit way later down the line...

the break limit items are debatable, but like i said, i'm not throwing 20 drag eyes at one anytime soon, which is far more expensive than the 73 bucks you said they're worth...

plus i said it's 21 pulls cause you are getting 3k magic jewels.... so, that makes it pretty much 60 bucks worth of pulls... the extra stuff is really 38 bucks

but that just makes the other one more worthwhile when looking at it since it's 11 pulls and some extra stuff for 30 bucks... which is normally a 10 pull price

it's not as "space-whaley" as you claim it to be.... but it isn't cheap either so it's still whale territory easily

I'm gonna address the immediate things first.

Light gacha eidolons are usually not worth it. The only ones you'd want are light Kaiser, and the 100%. The point of spending more SSR tickets on light eidolons is moot, simply because 1. Events are a thing, 2. Stats and LB are a thing, 3. You aren't even guaranteed to get that element and 4. the only light and dark 100%s have that mechanic, all the other elements have a constant 100% to rely on.

Next, the brick. Here's the gap in logic: why not... just leave it alone? The game certainly doesn't require you to spam bricks on your weapon, and while yes, they are super tasty for non event SSR weapons... they aren't necessary to the cash conserver. There's a clear reason why bricks are associated with whales, no matter the source it's fucking expensive.

Your pull mathematics is another thing. Always apply Murphy's Law in RNG. A random draw, is as good as no draw. This is the reality that cash conservative players work with.

And then there's your mindset. The issue I see, is that you have the money, and you're willing to spend it. And you're not playing a patience game. These 3 things combo into one thing very well: higher probability of spending... which is fine! However, you need to be aware, your definition of good value is drastically different from the cash conservatives. We value consistency with our money, which is why we only ever recommend the guaranteed stuff: miracle tickets. Everything else is a risk. And a risk is not worth taking as a poor consumer.

nonsensei

06-25-2018, 02:55 AM

So let's make this clear. It's an awesome offer.. for whales.
People who buy only mtix & maybe SSR KH guaranteed might not want to bother with it. It's not that "You can't miss this offer, you will regret later if you do" type of offer, but it's pretty good.. and yeah, it's also pretty expensive. No need to force yourself to buy it.

MagicSpice

06-25-2018, 03:00 AM

I'm gonna address the immediate things first.

Light gacha eidolons are usually not worth it. The only ones you'd want are light Kaiser, and the 100%. The point of spending more SSR tickets on light eidolons is moot, simply because 1. Events are a thing, 2. Stats and LB are a thing, 3. You aren't even guaranteed to get that element and 4. the only light and dark 100%s have that mechanic, all the other elements have a constant 100% to rely on.

Next, the brick. Here's the gap in logic: why not... just leave it alone? The game certainly doesn't require you to spam bricks on your weapon, and while yes, they are super tasty for non event SSR weapons... they aren't necessary to the cash conserver. There's a clear reason why bricks are associated with whales, no matter the source it's fucking expensive.

Your pull mathematics is another thing. Always apply Murphy's Law in RNG. A random draw, is as good as no draw. This is the reality that cash conservative players work with.

And then there's your mindset. The issue I see, is that you have the money, and you're willing to spend it. And you're not playing a patience game. These 3 things combo into one thing very well: higher probability of spending... which is fine! However, you need to be aware, your definition of good value is drastically different from the cash conservatives. We value consistency with our money, which is why we only ever recommend the guaranteed stuff: miracle tickets. Everything else is a risk. And a risk is not worth taking as a poor consumer.

1) Events are a thing, with random cycled elements meaning it could be a while before the one you need comes up.

2) I said it's worth getting for the value... i never once said you have to get it. what i'm saying is that there isn't much downside to getting it if you do, but i also said it's expensive and said a few times that the average player likely won't get it

3) yes.... RNG is a thing... even with SSR Kami guaranteed gacha... we all know this... hell, i've gotten 5 kami weapons to lv100 now so imagine the other kami i probably could have pulled with those 10 drag eyes...

4) i'm not the type to blindly throw money the game, otherwise i'd do it every single time i see a strong kami appeared... this is purely assumption about me so remove that from your logic. i do try to encourage players to go for the SSR guaranteed if anything when throwing money at the game, which by the way, ups the chance of getting said 100% or kaiser eidolons

granted, this is a difference of opinion. but just to be sure i clarified my point, yes it is worth the value, but no, it's not something you have to go after. even when it comes to tossing magic jewels or tickets at a specific time in the game, you still are taking a risk and it's up to the player themselves if they believe it's worth the risk, therefore it is never a necessity, even when it comes to the best gacha in the game which is the miracle ticket gacha. there are a few people that can not, or refused to get even that gacha

also, light and dark 100% aren't the only ones that have that mechanic (some event ones do so as well), but these two definitely say hi way later down the line (which only helps the options for getting the gamebreaking eidolons for wind/thunder):

10568

Cobblemaniac

06-25-2018, 03:13 AM

snip

It is indeed assumptuous on my part, my apologies.

I do find issue with the value of the pack however. 98 bucks is nothing to sneeze at after all. Slashley has already broken down and said most of what I want to say regarding the values, so I’ll refrain. End of the day, it’s about perceived value, and I won’t attempt to change that.

Also, I believe you misinterpreted the last part. What I was trying to say was that while they aren’t the only elements with the eidolon stack mechanics, they are the only elements whose strongest eidolons have no other option than to play with that limitation. The other elements have their respective 100% eidolons, and then you have the 2 extra ones on top of that.

Ginger D Arc

06-25-2018, 07:11 AM

Cobblemaniac

06-25-2018, 07:20 AM

Hindsight being 20/20, and the fact I pulled complete trash from the gacha..

I'd hoped to get a better outcome, but realize it is up to the RNG Gods if I get anything worthwhile in that draw.
I personally don't regret spending a little (with conversion it's more than a little, to be honest), if it helps to keep the servers running.

I'm going to hang on the the Chaldea and Argentum for now, until I'm sure of where they'll best be used.

Chaldea is only really useful for Kaiser Dragoons and 100% eidolons.

On the lucky side of things, Kaiser Dragoons are made buyable with the raid eidolon store... expected to be implemented a month later?

As for the Argentum (we prefer calling those bricks), the best value you get out of them is from breaking dragon eye weapons. Where that fails, the next best option is a non-event SSR weapon of 1. your element and 2. a good 4LB boost. The link below lists all the current SSR weapons that exist within the DMM game now, so just take a look and see if you possess any weapons with a particularly tasty future 4LB. I hope you're fluent with google translate.

http://xn--hckqz0e9cygq471ahu9b.xn--wiki-4i9hs14f.com/index.php?SSR%E3%82%A6%E3%82%A7%E3%83%9D%E3%83%B3

Ginger D Arc

06-25-2018, 07:52 AM

So far as Eidolons, I currently possess Rudra, Aqua SSR Dragoon (at level 40) & Evil SSR Dragoon (at level 85).

I will look at the link you provided! Thank you very much!

Unregistered

06-25-2018, 02:09 PM

SlickFenix

06-25-2018, 02:55 PM

I've got 3 SSR of different elements: Aphrodite, Raphael and Brahma. My original plan was to go all water, since I got a lot of water SR, but now I don't know. Should I stick with 1 element, or should I play all my SSR?

You'll want to stick with 1 element of Kami. Don't Rainbow your Kami team unless the skills that the off element Kami bring are worth it. The part that really makes a team strong is the weapons grid.

MagicSpice

06-25-2018, 07:01 PM

I've got 3 SSR of different elements: Aphrodite, Raphael and Brahma. My original plan was to go all water, since I got a lot of water SR, but now I don't know. Should I stick with 1 element, or should I play all my SSR?

stick to one element, likely water considering you said you have a lot of water SR... if you're gonna work on other teams (you should later), stick to one element on them (eventually having 6 teams, all a different element)

same element teams allow you to do this level of damage easy:

10580

and it only gets better with a stronger grid, cause I only have 2% base assault from pride, 40% HP (don't need that much), and 54.5% assault

mind you, this is enough damage to one-shot ultimate normal enemies basically

Unregistered

06-26-2018, 12:45 AM

Thanks, so I want kami all the same element, is that the same for weapons and eido as well?

Also, what do I do with my rare eido, since I can't use them to skill up, just use as exp fodder?

Cobblemaniac

06-26-2018, 01:53 AM

Thanks, so I want kami all the same element, is that the same for weapons and eido as well?

Also, what do I do with my rare eido, since I can't use them to skill up, just use as exp fodder?

The 2 things you need to stick to: a single element per team, AND a collection of single element weapons which are the same element as your himes/ soul. The way they work is the weapons possess skills that give stat buffs only to the element of said weapon, therefore both conditions are same element.

Eidolons are... slightly more flexible. The general rule of thumb is that your main eidolon is either your team's element, or their eidolon effect buffs your team's element. For sub eidolons, you generally want to go for stats. Atk is preferred. The only exceptions are if they have really good eidolon effects, such as Vine, if you don't have 50% def break.

Use the R eidolons as XP fodder. Outside of Vine (and maybe, but less so Anzu and Yamata no Orochi), all SR and below eidolons are safely fodder.

blubbergott

06-26-2018, 02:04 AM

Thanks, so I want kami all the same element, is that the same for weapons and eido as well?

All but the main eido are just there for stats and their summon. Same ele eidolons get 10% more stats. Mostly pick for summons + decent stats and just add the 10% on top of any same ele ones when comparing.

Weapons, ultimately yes, you'll want a grid of 10 same element assault weapons. At start though, you'll mostly be looking for stats, so an off element SSR is waaaay better than a same element R. Element only becomes relevant when leveling weapon skills, which is generally only worth it imo for: max break assault/pride SSR, max break assault SR, lower break dual skill SSR (assault + defender). There are ofc always some exceptions that might be worth it in certain scenarios, but take that as a rule of thumb. It takes a lot of time and skill level fodder to really upgrade all grids, so it's not too wise to waste them.

Slashley

06-26-2018, 03:05 AM

--
Use the R eidolons as XP fodder. Outside of Vine (and maybe, but less so Anzu and Yamata no Orochi), all SR and below eidolons are safely fodder.Speaking of this, with the Eidolon Orb store approaching, Yamata no Orochi is going to replace Vine for many due to her way higher stats at LMB (assuming that you've pulled even one Yamata). Although Vine has 100% hitrate with Mordred's debuff- and Yamata no Orochi can fail against Water and Thunder, it's probably still a better idea.

That said... we've entered the era of Hercules finally, she brings 25% Def Down in the same frame as Vine/Yamata do 10/12%. So all of that is a moot point, I guess.

Quarters

06-26-2018, 03:23 AM

Near as I can tell, I'm supposed to ask for advice/thoughts here in the general discussion/Q&A thread.

Been playing Kamihime since October (fell off mid November but returned mid January) and worked darned hard to fight against what the game seemed determined to give me in order to build up the kind of team I wanted. (Game threw a lot of water at me early on).

Now I have a nice Wind team sitting at 36275 power (compared to water 31933), with some good weapons and eidolons. I've finally obtained enough Gale Gem Idea Regalias for a Soul Weapon, and as luck would have it, my preferred Soul since I started play just had her weapons released. That said, I'm kinda torn on which one to get.

Wind Spear Crest Flag or Wind Sword Saint Gauche?

The former boosts HP and Joan's defense buff, while the latter boosts attack and reduces the cooldown on Joan's regen/double atk buff.

So which, in general is more useful? And secondly, which compliments my team more?

My team is:
F/Joan of Arc (20) - Equipped with Cagliostro's Medic Potion
F/Gaia [Awakened] (49) ***
F/Hastur (76) ****
B/Azazel (70) ****
B/Ithaqua (70) ****
S/Cronus (50) ****
S/Cybele (70) ****
Weapons Overall HP/ATK: 759/14946
Eidolons Overall HP/ATK: 2856/9568

Slashley

06-26-2018, 03:43 AM

That said, I'm kinda torn on which one to get. The attack one. They're just too good to pass up on. Don't look at the skill they buff, the passive you get from skill leveling the Relic weapon is wayyyy more important almost always.

To be noted is that generally, Hercules is considered to be the go-to Soul these days as her offensive Relic weapon is insanely good, plus it works insanely well with Provisional Forest (the best EX skill if you can support it). You seem to really like playing a tanky build, though. If so, I guess you can go for Joan's offensive weapon as well.

Even then, I'd highly recommend you bring Sniper Shot over Medic Potion, as dropping enemy Def and Atk by 20% is a huge deal.

Mraktar

06-26-2018, 03:55 AM

Speaking of this, with the Eidolon Orb store approaching, Yamata no Orochi is going to replace Vine for many due to her way higher stats at LMB (assuming that you've pulled even one Yamata). Although Vine has 100% hitrate with Mordred's debuff- and Yamata no Orochi can fail against Water and Thunder, it's probably still a better idea.

That said... we've entered the era of Hercules finally, she brings 25% Def Down in the same frame as Vine/Yamata do 10/12%. So all of that is a moot point, I guess.

If i have Hrae, does it means that i don't need a) Herc relic axe for any element b)Herc by herself? I'm thinking about next soul Andy vs Herc.

Slashley

06-26-2018, 04:21 AM

Hrae isn't available on turn10, so you probably still want Hercules - except maybe in Wind since you probably have a lot of Hraes friends, using friend-Hraes on turn1 is quite good.

... even then, Herc still has extremely good skills. That self-damage cut (reflect) makes her tanky as fuck, and her combo+ means that she'll be less of a bottleneck for Full Bursts. Add in a big nuke from her first skill and the ability to use PF without help and... damn. Herc is just REALLY fucking good.

If you're running a Wind chain-burst build (with Titania and other high burst generation Hime), then Shingen is probably better though. Thunder struggles for debuffs, so Dartagnan HP there is the norm. For all else, Herc is just... too good.

Quarters

06-26-2018, 04:26 AM

The attack one. They're just too good to pass up on. Don't look at the skill they buff, the passive you get from skill leveling the Relic weapon is wayyyy more important almost always.

To be noted is that generally, Hercules is considered to be the go-to Soul these days as her offensive Relic weapon is insanely good, plus it works insanely well with Provisional Forest (the best EX skill if you can support it). You seem to really like playing a tanky build, though. If so, I guess you can go for Joan's offensive weapon as well.

Even then, I'd highly recommend you bring Sniper Shot over Medic Potion, as dropping enemy Def and Atk by 20% is a huge deal.

Cool, I'll try Sniper Shot. As for the tank build, that's coincidence. All that mattered to me was Joan of Arc for my Soul (I'm obsessed with Jehanne D'Arc no matter the medium) and Wind is my favorite element. Miracle Ticket #1 got me Gaia while #2 was used on Azazel (#3 may go to Aphrodite as water is my only team lacking an SSR and that's my secondary team for when I have to face fire.) Hastur and Ithaqua were lucky pulls within days of each other and Cronus is recent. It was really nice that a guaranteed SSR ticket was nice enough to give me a second copy of Hastur's weapon + a Dragon Eye, greatly reducing the time to awaken Gaia.

Unregistered

06-26-2018, 11:39 AM

Aside from SSRguaranteed Hime, are any other gachas worth paying money for?

AutoCrimson

06-26-2018, 11:53 AM

SSR guaranteed is not worth it also

MT is only one

nonsensei

06-26-2018, 11:59 AM

My ordering would go like this:
Mtix >>> SSR guaranteed KH > Brick offer > SSR guaranteed eido > Daily 120 coin yolo > ... whatever, you're a damned whale at this point.

Some corrections made according to post below.

Slashley

06-26-2018, 12:13 PM

My ordering would go like this:
Mtix >>> SSR guaranteed KH > SSR guaranteed eido > Brick offer > Daily 120 coin yolo > ... whatever, you're a damned whale at this point.Sounds about right, though, I wouldn't put Eidolons on that list at all. Gacha Eidolons are only good if you land on P2W or Kaisers, and at least P2W ones are extremely heavily weighted down. Additionally, although it has so far been a one-time thing, Exclusive Gacha is basically a Miracle Ticket with double the price - on average. The Exclusive Gachas are still gambling though, so you might end up paying 200 bucks - or more - if you're unlucky.

So, my version:
Mtix (50 bucks for what you want) >> Exclusive Gacha (100 bucks for what you want) >> SSR guaranteed KH (50 bucks for random) > Brick offer (30 bucks for one Limit Break) > whale territory

nonsensei

06-26-2018, 12:39 PM

Sounds about right, though, I wouldn't put Eidolons on that list at all. Gacha Eidolons are only good if you land on P2W or Kaisers, and at least P2W ones are extremely heavily weighted down. Additionally, although it has so far been a one-time thing, Exclusive Gacha is basically a Miracle Ticket with double the price - on average. The Exclusive Gachas are still gambling though, so you might end up paying 200 bucks - or more - if you're unlucky.

So, my version:
Mtix (50 bucks for what you want) >> Exclusive Gacha (100 bucks for what you want) >> SSR guaranteed KH (50 bucks for random) > Brick offer (30 bucks for one Limit Break) > whale territory

Right, I forgot about exclusive since it wasn't even supposed to be here at all to begin with. :rofl:
And yeah, some correction on eido offer -> only worth it if you reached the whale point. Afterwards, the value will go up to where it was originally. Otherwise, ignore.

Thinking about it, brick offer should overtake eido offer, since it gives you SSR KH/eido ticket & 2x10 pulls. :think: ... and bricks. Certainly more pricey, but.. uhh.. whatever, I'm lazy to think about it.

Mraktar

06-26-2018, 12:53 PM

Slashley

06-26-2018, 01:00 PM

Well, that team is not really capable of chain bursting, so Hercules.

Mraktar

06-26-2018, 01:19 PM

Well, that team is not really capable of chain bursting, so Hercules.

But i can get -50def on turn 1 with no Hercules weapon - just with friend's Hrae, Hastur's ambush and Iblis's b-frame. Is Herc's axe still best choice if i only will get + 30 burst on 3rd skill and great assault bonus?

Unregistered

06-26-2018, 01:25 PM

Should Y use my brick for Aphrodite's bow or save it?

Slashley

06-26-2018, 01:33 PM

But i can get -50def on turn 1 with no Hercules weapon - just with friend's Hrae, Hastur's ambush and Iblis's b-frame. Is Herc's axe still best choice if i only will get + 30 burst on 3rd skill and great assault bonus?Yes, because Herc has great abilities by herself. I guess your other option would be Mordred...? Debuff- and BP are not bad. But Herc, particularly with PF, should still do extremely well.
Should Y use my brick for Aphrodite's bow or save it?Only use Bricks once FLBs are out and you'd be able to FLB the item right after. And obviously only FLB weapons that are good once FLB'd.

Mraktar

06-26-2018, 01:48 PM

Yes, because Herc has great abilities by herself. I guess your other option would be Mordred...? Debuff- and BP are not bad. But Herc, particularly with PF, should still do extremely well.

It will take more then a half of year to get PF unfortunately so Herc's ex should be BP.

Xarges

06-26-2018, 03:41 PM

What a good starting character for dark, Hades or Satan?

Shieun

06-26-2018, 03:53 PM

If you have to pick one or the other, I'm leaning towards Satan probably

Although bear in mind that if this is a re-roll and you plan to f2p, your next SSR hime could be other element.

MagicSpice

06-26-2018, 05:11 PM

If you have to pick one or the other, I'm leaning towards Satan probably

Although bear in mind that if this is a re-roll and you plan to f2p, your next SSR hime could be other element.

How good is Awakened Hades though?

Sure it requires more mats (and 3 drag eyes) but that might overshadow Satan in the long run

(Honestly, between thanatos and SSR Amon, I have little use for satan)

In fact, if someone made a Tier list for all the Kami, that'd help a ton period

LeCrestfallen

06-26-2018, 08:25 PM

Hades awakening is pretty mediocre compared to other awakenings, her base kit is good, but in the long run, not sure if its worth it to keep her
( i myself will replace her with pluto if we get another Mticket, and keep satan since her awakening is quite good, additonal -10% dark down on her def down, +15burst gauge when using orb eater)

Unregistered

06-26-2018, 08:39 PM

SlickFenix

06-26-2018, 09:32 PM

Hi, I have a question someone here mentioning you can sell the SSR eidos for points to exchange for SSR Kaiser.
My question is are all SSR eidos eligible or only from raid ones, since I'm kinda running low on space for eidolon and prefer to save jewel for gacha instead.

It is another shop that is still about 2 months away. You can sell all Eidos of R rarity (not the Enhance Material ones) and higher for points. Gacha ones will give more points than event ones. But yes, you can trade in the SSRs as well. If you're low on inventory space just increase it a little. I have all inventories at max upgrades. The trick to it is that you don't have to do it all at once. Personally, when they did these login bonuses that would give us 1500 jewels, I would use about 500 of them towards inventory upgrades. I was still able to pull Gacha and increased my inventory at the same time. And now that we get even more jewels as rewards in events, it is so much easier to do.

Slashley

06-27-2018, 02:42 AM

Hi, I have a question someone here mentioning you can sell the SSR eidos for points to exchange for SSR Kaiser.
My question is are all SSR eidos eligible or only from raid ones, since I'm kinda running low on space for eidolon and prefer to save jewel for gacha instead.Save up (and Limit Break up to 3-stars, MLB is Gem expensive) all Gacha SSRs and event SSRs, and Disaster SRs. Kaisers are a whopping 10k Orbs each, so they're not particularly cheap.

You can also technically save Gem Gacha Rs and/or Gacha SRs (which sell for as much as Disaster SRs), but if you ask me, those will take too much inventory space to be worth it.

Jewel gacha is extremely unlikely to give you anything good, whileas inventory expansion will make your daily Gem Gacha much, much faster every day. At least until the next anniversary Gem Gacha update that is, which is still far, far away. As such, inventory expansion > Jewel Gacha.

Mraktar

06-27-2018, 05:46 AM

Gacha r are only 2 orbs each, there is no single reason to save them - space is limited, so use them as fodder if needed, sell them for 10 gems othervice. Gacha sr are the same 30 orbs as disasters, so you may save them too.

Cobblemaniac

06-27-2018, 05:48 AM

MagicSpice

06-27-2018, 02:23 PM

Save up (and Limit Break up to 3-stars, MLB is Gem expensive) all Gacha SSRs and event SSRs, and Disaster SRs. Kaisers are a whopping 10k Orbs each, so they're not particularly cheap.

You can also technically save Gem Gacha Rs and/or Gacha SRs (which sell for as much as Disaster SRs), but if you ask me, those will take too much inventory space to be worth it.

Jewel gacha is extremely unlikely to give you anything good, whileas inventory expansion will make your daily Gem Gacha much, much faster every day. At least until the next anniversary Gem Gacha update that is, which is still far, far away. As such, inventory expansion > Jewel Gacha.

Actually that more or less depends on if they need more Kami to make at least 2 suitable teams...

After that, then I'd go ham on inventory space considering there's a lot of magic jewels you can get now

Except for I managed just well for a long time with just 150 weapon and Eidolon slots, so it may depend on how much stuff you collected. Regardless of the method though, you'll still cap space eventually cause you'll want the space to hold all those event SSR (I now have 270 weapon slots due to this and about 170 Eidolon slots)

When the raid eidolon store releases... gemcha will simply have more value I guess :bgrin:

Yeah, cause I normally feed R eidolons as exp fodder (along with N)

Now I don't even need to go that far and they'll soon just speed up the process of getting the kaisers

Unregistered

06-27-2018, 06:08 PM

Have osiris, Satán, beelzebub, Bastet, Sol Awakened, and of course sussanno.
My cuestión is, Do I need to awoken sussanno to improve my dark team event more or wait until Satán get her Awakened form?
Only have 3 dragonic eyes by the way.

SlickFenix

06-27-2018, 09:18 PM

AW Susanoo does a lot of damage. However, I think Satan may have more utility to her since she will have a -25% Def debuff and can eat a burst charge from the boss.

Cobblemaniac

06-28-2018, 07:35 AM

Well. Summer girls are now on jewel gacha.

Time to waste 60 pulls and get absolutely nothing...

Slashley

06-28-2018, 07:39 AM

Why do you even want them...?

They're basically worse version of their originals.

Cobblemaniac

06-28-2018, 07:41 AM

Why do you even want them...?

They're basically worse version of their originals.

I see Sol.

Let me waste my jewels in peace would ya

BlazeAlter

06-28-2018, 08:31 AM

Waifu + Swimsuit factor obviously

if I had some spare jewels, I would've liked to get even just Brynhildr lol

Unregistered

06-28-2018, 12:45 PM

Every hime has a preferred weapon type and element.

Of course, the ideal would be to have 3* SSR of my element (water) and the types that my hime like, but I'm fa from there yet.

So, in the meantime, what is the order of briority between:

a) wrong type, wrong element SSR
b) Right element, wrong type SR
C) Right type, wrong element SR

Slashley

06-28-2018, 01:03 PM

Ummm, while it's true that they do have a preferred type of weapon, you should just ignore it. It's just 20% extra stats from *that* weapon to the Hime who prefers it. So a 2000 Atk Gun gives 2400 Atk for Mammon and 2000 Atk for everyone else.

However, unless you're an ultra massive, space-time continuum bending whale, you don't really get to choose what is in your grid and what isn't. You'll just use your best weapon skills.

So, the order priority is really simple:
1. Same element, wrong type SSR.
2. Same element, wrong type SR.
3. Doesn't matter.

And everything that happens to be correct type just happens to be a small bonus. You pick your team based on Hime skills, NOT based on their Weapon preferral, after all.

Aidoru

06-28-2018, 01:11 PM

They do not have a preferred element. It's not optional. It's required or they won't get the skill effect. The only reason to use off element weapons is if you're new and need something to fill in temporarily. Using an off element weapon because of its type does not make up for the loss of its skill.

Unless you're a hardcore whale with several completed SSR weapons to choose from, weapon type is not something you will have to worry about for several years of playing. Even free players who've played from launch still don't have full SSR weapon grids unless they got lucky with gacha and even then, many event SSR weapons don't have assault.

Unregistered

06-28-2018, 03:57 PM

In my Wather grid weapon I have lots of sr weapons with max limit break that have better stats than an ssr weapon without LB. It is always better to have ssr weapons besides sr weapons, even if they have worse stats? I mean, both weapons have assault skil.

Think about this; sr weapon MLB with lvl 10 assault skill vs ssr weapon without LB and lvl 5 assault. I know ssr weapons hace 3%more bonus than sr weapons. I guess in the long run a stand alone ssr weapon always is better than a max LB sr weapon when both reach lvl 20 skill. But I want to know your opinion.

And final question; Do you recommend to max skill lvl sr weapons or save materials for new possible ssr weapons? In my dark grid have six ssr weapons, and four sr weappns. One of my ssr weapons is a stand alone, without LB (from gacha), and has horrible stats. But it have assault, and I manage to reach lvl skill 10. My others sr weapons are MLB and have almos 2k total power, all lvl skill assault 14. Which one do I need to max skill lvl first?

Slashley

06-28-2018, 04:31 PM

Think about this; sr weapon MLB with lvl 10 assault skill vs ssr weapon without LB and lvl 5 assault.SSRs are basically 6 skill levels above SRs, so a slvl4 Assault SSR will do as much damage as a slvl10 Assault SR. Assuming equal stats, of course. But LMB SSRs will (almost) always have more stats than SRs.
And final question; Do you recommend to max skill lvl sr weapons or save materials for new possible ssr weapons?--Because you can farm Gem Quests with Half Elixirs, which you can then gain back from Gem Gacha, weapon fodder is just a matter of time. If you have LMB SSRs, level those up first (ESPECIALLY dual-skills, even if those dual-skills are not LMB!).

tl;dr; just work hard~

Unregistered

06-28-2018, 04:46 PM

Even if they are pride weapons? Cause I have assault ssr weapons bot without LM, and pride weapons MLB. Do I need to keep lvling ssr pride weapons or sr MLB sr assault weapons?

I was sure that sr assault weapons give more attack than pride...

Slashley

06-28-2018, 04:58 PM

Pride weapons are good. Not using them is not even a question until you have a full SSR grid. Prides give you Assault, plus a bonus when you lose HP. So don't consider them "bad", consider them as "good with bonus damage"

QXZ

06-28-2018, 06:29 PM

Question: what is the optimal strategy to roll a 100% eidolon? assuming i don't plan to rerolling for new acct.

Ikki

06-28-2018, 07:38 PM

Question: what is the optimal strategy to roll a 100% eidolon? assuming i don't plan to rerolling for new acct.

is this bait.

Cobblemaniac

06-28-2018, 07:43 PM

Question: what is the optimal strategy to roll a 100% eidolon? assuming i don't plan to rerolling for new acct.

Rob a bank

LeCrestfallen

06-28-2018, 07:55 PM

yeah Rob a bank sounds like solid advice, afterwards just keep Rolling, Rolling, Rolling.
Throw in some random limp bizkit track in the background ~~

Cobblemaniac

06-28-2018, 08:03 PM

yeah Rob a bank sounds like solid advice, afterwards just keep Rolling, Rolling, Rolling.
Throw in some random limp bizkit track in the background ~~

They see me rollin
They hatin
Patrolling they tryin to catch me ridin' dirty

Double post edit:

Why hello there light Cthulhu

http://xn--hckqz0e9cygq471ahu9b.xn--wiki-4i9hs14f.com/index.php?%E3%83%AB%E3%83%BC

MagicSpice

06-28-2018, 11:27 PM

Question: what is the optimal strategy to roll a 100% eidolon? assuming i don't plan to rerolling for new acct.

pray one pops out of an SSR eidolon ticket or a normal SSR ticket (one of my lucky as hell union members got Belial from the grab bag and their fire team is their weakest ironically).

other than that, your wallet needs to prepare it's anus cause even with rate up, good luck seeing one...

but considering DMM side eventually got a stronger Miracle ticket (for 25 drag eyes....) maybe that one lets you pick eidolons? even if it does, it'll be a while before we see it

Even if they are pride weapons? Cause I have assault ssr weapons bot without LM, and pride weapons MLB. Do I need to keep lvling ssr pride weapons or sr MLB sr assault weapons?

I was sure that sr assault weapons give more attack than pride...

they do until you start to lose HP.

Pride acts like R level assault (we call it small due to no pluses). but it also gives up to nearly triple it's original atk boost depending on your HP (we get another one called vigor eventually, which is the opposite of pride but the premise is still current HP affects the extra boost).

personally, i feel it's situational on how good it truly is, but you can't deny the attack boost it'll still net you. plus a lot of them get both good stats and extra effects later on so you're gonna want them either way.

at least when we can start sticking pride with vigor, it'll balance out. but for now, pride is a small assault with a situational and fluctuating bonus

but DO NOT keep yourself at low HP unless you know you can survive. to get the max bonus from Pride weapons, you need to have 5% OR LESS of your max HP remaining... that's VERY dangerous and should honestly be avoided when you can.

Ikki

06-29-2018, 12:06 AM

Why hello there light Cthulhu

I cant write anything but *facepalm*

Bear

06-29-2018, 12:13 AM

Why hello there light Cthulhu

http://xn--hckqz0e9cygq471ahu9b.xn--wiki-4i9hs14f.com/index.php?%E3%83%AB%E3%83%BC

Dude.... don't. Just don't. Don't even think about comparing Cthulhu with Lugh.

Slashley

06-29-2018, 12:20 AM

but DO NOT keep yourself at low HP unless you know you can survive. to get the max bonus from Pride weapons, you need to have 5% OR LESS of your max HP remaining... that's VERY dangerous and should honestly be avoided when you can.... nobody cares about the "max bonus" of Pride. Stop thinking in that way. Just think of them as Assault weapons that happen to give you bonus damage as the fight progresses.
Dude.... don't. Just don't. Don't even think about comparing Cthulhu with Lugh.And why not?

On a quick glance, as fellow C-frame Hime, their only difference is that Cthulhu was introduced in pre-Herc era where a C-frame debuff alone made her a God, whileas Lugh is introduced in an era where a C frame is "meh, I guess that's an option."

Ikki

06-29-2018, 12:22 AM

On a quick glance, as fellow C-frame Hime, their only difference is that Cthulhu was introduced in pre-Herc era where a C-frame debuff alone made her a God, whileas Lugh is introduced in an era where a C frame is "meh, I guess that's an option."

Cause Cthulhu is not even near the dmg Lugh can deal, their mechanics and how they are used are totally diff, if thats the case then lets start calling Mammon the thunder Cthulhu, oh and Thanatos the dark Cthulhu too.

Mirage

06-29-2018, 12:27 AM

They both have C frame debuff, they must be similar :smirk:

Cobblemaniac

06-29-2018, 01:32 AM

They both have C frame debuff, they must be similar :smirk:

That is what I based my idea on after all.

But yeah, the differences end there.

Forgive me for being too lazy to compare other himes?

Unregistered

06-29-2018, 08:35 AM

You mean the similarities end there, not differences. But yea, the other skills fulfill completely different roles.

Meanwhile, the SR from that particular batch, Belenus, has the funky gimmick of 2 of her skills being modified whenever she's blinded. And 3rd skill is self zeal and blind. And the skill descriptions just sound so chuuni. Actually, can someone recap how her skills work? I'm not 100% sure from reading the wiki entry.

BlazeAlter

06-29-2018, 08:45 AM

http://i63.tinypic.com/ofbm7k.png

...these google translated lines lmao
10612

Cobblemaniac

06-29-2018, 08:47 AM

http://i63.tinypic.com/ofbm7k.png

...these google translated lines lmao
10612

... which hime is this?

Edit: Well nvm. The new SR apparently.

This is probably the least informative wiki entry I've seen in quite some time, although it probably makes more sense in Japanese?

BlazeAlter

06-29-2018, 08:52 AM

... which hime is this?

Edit: Well nvm. The new SR apparently.

This is probably the least informative wiki entry I've seen in quite some time, although it probably makes more sense in Japanese?

its too chuunibyou for me to understand lmao
it might make more sense in japanese but this is the most weirdest translation i've ever seen lol

nonsensei

06-29-2018, 09:06 AM

This is probably the least informative wiki entry I've seen in quite some time, although it probably makes more sense in Japanese?

This is the actual in game ability description (well, as per the google translate, tho). Devs went all-out with the new chuuni character.

Cobblemaniac

06-29-2018, 09:09 AM

Skill descriptions? Check

10614

Smug(?) look? Check

One eye is a different colour and is shining? Check.

Yup. Definitely a chuuni hime.

Can already imagine what her scenes are like

SlickFenix

06-29-2018, 09:20 AM

but considering DMM side eventually got a stronger Miracle ticket (for 25 drag eyes....) maybe that one lets you pick eidolons? even if it does, it'll be a while before we see it

IIRC they have a True Miracle Ticket on DMM for 150 Dragon Eyes that will let you choose Anything (Including Limited and the 100 and 120 Eidos). That is the Space Lord Mega Whale Ticket. Probably need to own a bank to whale enough for that. Although, even if you have enough eyes, if you whaled that much would you really be missing anything?

Cobblemaniac

06-29-2018, 09:30 AM

IIRC they have a True Miracle Ticket on DMM for 150 Dragon Eyes that will let you choose Anything (Including Limited and the 100 and 120 Eidos). That is the Space Lord Mega Whale Ticket. Probably need to own a bank to whale enough for that. Although, even if you have enough eyes, if you whaled that much would you really be missing anything?

Hey, welcome to the joke I've been making around the forums:

For just a low low price of 150 eyes, you too, can pull any limited edition hime you so desire!

Err, there's literally nothing else.

SlickFenix

06-29-2018, 09:35 AM

If you miss Summer Sol this time around.... That's your ticket :smirk:

bmj420420

06-29-2018, 10:24 PM

When does DMM reveal their next set of summer units (if they have them this year)?

BlazeAlter

06-29-2018, 11:14 PM

When does DMM reveal their next set of summer units (if they have them this year)?

next event on Adramalech lol

edit: oh wait, didn't read it hard enough lol (i thought nutaku). maybe soon in july

Cobblemaniac

06-30-2018, 01:06 AM

next event on Adramalech lol

edit: oh wait, didn't read it hard enough lol (i thought nutaku). maybe soon in july

2 events later I'd wager?

BlazeAlter

06-30-2018, 01:21 AM

2 events later I'd wager?

..possibly

I wonder which swimsuit himes they'll do next lol..

I'd honestly want to see Osiris and Amon in swimsuits

Unregistered

06-30-2018, 04:54 AM

which element should i focus on
Light Team:LT tsukuyomi,sol aw,raph,diana,sub:eros,artem
Dark Team:Dark amaterasu,thanatos,bastet,osiris,sub: randa,pharol

Tnx

Unregistered

06-30-2018, 05:18 AM

which element should i focus on
Light Team:LT tsukuyomi,sol aw,raph,diana,sub:eros,artem
Dark Team:Dark amaterasu,thanatos,bastet,osiris,sub: randa,pharol

Tnx

Just level both grids? lol
You have to level 6 grids anyway...

Both team looks good. Just start with them that you like more and then the next one.

Aidoru

06-30-2018, 07:41 AM

The light team because there's a dark event coming up after the next event but the next light event won't be for another 2 months (assuming nutaku follows the schedule), so the dark team can wait.

Unregistered

06-30-2018, 07:47 AM

The light team because there's a dark event coming up after the next event but the next light event won't be for another 2 months (assuming nutaku follows the schedule), so the dark team can wait.
tnx for telling me :)

MagicSpice

06-30-2018, 10:51 AM

tnx for telling me :)

bonus points if you make yourself capable of doing the ragnarok mission next event cause that also needs a light team

Just level both grids? lol
You have to level 6 grids anyway...

Both team looks good. Just start with them that you like more and then the next one.

one is bound to get used sooner than the other given how events work, and in this case, light wins.

next raid event needs a light team for the ragnarok mission, and even then the next union event after that gives elemental advantage to light

bigblackcock

06-30-2018, 11:38 AM

there is something i would like to know, maybe someone asked it before, but i'm too lazy to search it lol
anyway, there is this item that can limit break SSR weapons "Holy steel argentum" if i'm not mistaken
does anyone knows if it can limit break MLB weapon to FLB?

Bear

06-30-2018, 11:42 AM

No. 10 char

Unregistered

06-30-2018, 12:35 PM

Is this game something for casual player?

Aidoru

06-30-2018, 02:32 PM

Is this game something for casual player?

With how much they've reduced cost for event rewards, you can play as a casual player and still complete event eidolon/weapons but don't expect to clear some of the harder content without putting some time into the game.

MagicSpice

06-30-2018, 04:26 PM

Is this game something for casual player?

Yes, but it'll take you longer to be ready for harder content.

Events are more grind friendly and give better rewards overall so it's actually more about how much are you willing to grind.

I'm not too far above the casual mark myself, but I've also played since day 1. You can flood your inventory with a lot of SSR over time, even if you don't pay for it.

Shieun

06-30-2018, 08:05 PM

which element should i focus on
Light Team:LT tsukuyomi,sol aw,raph,diana,sub:eros,artem
Dark Team:Dark amaterasu,thanatos,bastet,osiris,sub: randa,pharol

Tnx

Since you're asking this (and looking at your hime line up), I am assuming these are your next WIPs, and you already have one or two main element that are capable to clear events comfortably.

Both have the required core himes currently available in nutaku, and you need to use light team to clear next event rag quest (only gives raid tix, no harm in skipping)

Tough one to choose, but this depends on how many weapons you have on both grid. Consider the amount of assault/dual skills weapon you have in the grid. Add those skill % up and see which one gives you the higher total % for you.

Also if your light grid is not up to standard, dont waste too much of your time trying to clear the Adramalech Rag solo quest.

nut

06-30-2018, 08:27 PM

Should I consider farming story quest for materials to exchange it for the low stats assault weapon? Half of my weapon is still rare and disaster weapon just won't drop.

Cobblemaniac

06-30-2018, 10:01 PM

Should I consider farming story quest for materials to exchange it for the low stats assault weapon? Half of my weapon is still rare and disaster weapon just won't drop.

Don't waste the AP. The only thing worth getting from quests is Vine.

Stay patient my man.

nut

06-30-2018, 10:49 PM

Don't waste the AP. The only thing worth getting from quests is Vine.

Stay patient my man.

Thanks! Then I'll keep my raid train :sweat:

Unregistered

07-01-2018, 01:16 AM

Tough one to choose, but this depends on how many weapons you have on both grid. Consider the amount of assault/dual skills weapon you have in the grid. Add those skill % up and see which one gives you the higher total % for you.

Also if your light grid is not up to standard, dont waste too much of your time trying to clear the Adramalech Rag solo quest.
right now my light team have {3 ssr sl20,4 sr sl20,1 pride sl5{mlb}],sol gun 0* sl18,dup ssr 1* sl8
can clear any accesory rnk4 Quest, so my light is ready i think

asianstuff

07-01-2018, 10:05 AM

Haven't played this game for a long time.
But does anybody remember those 2 Wind type Kamehime; Boreas and Zephyrus? Found out a while ago that they're actually related and are the first half of the "Anemoi Sisters". Kinda interested in their backstory and how they look fighting together. Has the second half been introduced yet? I think their names, by mythology, should be Notus and Eurus.

drakkelizer

07-01-2018, 10:16 AM

Hey guys. I hope you're doing well. It's been a while since i last played because i'm living in Japan right now. I wanted to play again but when i try to enter the page says that is no longer available in my region. I suppose that I'll be forced to play the original DMM japanese version... So does that means that i'll have to start all over again? Do you know if I can transfer my account or something like that?

Unregistered

07-01-2018, 11:05 AM

Unregistered

07-01-2018, 12:41 PM

Unregistered

07-01-2018, 12:53 PM

I got Aphrodite for my 1st SSR a few weeks back, so I have been running a water team with her, other water kami SR with 3LB,4LB lvl 80 illu as my main eido, and 2 SR water eido, and 3 rare water Eido. Then yesterday I managed to pull Fafnir and Dakku from the MJ gatcha. I'm thinking, since Fafnir can buff fire and water, I shoud use her for my main eido, then I won't have to use an all water eido team. Also, since she buffs two elements, I can put Dakku on my water team.

Any reason why I shouldn't do that?

Yolodesu

07-01-2018, 01:15 PM

Today I tried to start a prison of ice catastrophe raid. When I see them in the mission lobby, they usually fill up in 5 minutes, but I didn't get a single help for the entire raid. 50 ap plus cores down the toilet. When it said who to request help from, I chose "all" do everyone on the server should have seen it, right? What can I do to make sure I get some help next time?

This boss is pretty annoying to fight because of her buffs, and other players can easily screw your fight if they make it proc at the wrong time.
For a lot of vet players it's simply easier to solo her, and for others, they are doing it with union members.

Also if you're the one i've seen earlier, she was still full life after 5~10 minutes. You can't really expect ppl to join in this condition.
Noobs wont join a boss who isn't already damaged, cause they know they can't kill it alone, and vets won't bother helping someone who doesn't want to fight (some ppl just hit the boss once and goes afk.)

Slashley

07-01-2018, 01:45 PM

-- should be Notus and Eurus.At least up until May, no. So not for the next 10 months at least in the English version.

There's just so many mythos to pull from, I guess they just weren't popular enough and DMM just forgot about them.
Today I tried to start a prison of ice catastrophe raid. -- When it said who to request help from, I chose "all" do everyone on the server should have seen it, right? --We don't know how the raid system works these days, but for certain, it doesn't work like that. It used to send out to everyone who was:
1. logged in when you sent it
2. was +- 20 Ranks from you
3. didn't already have 10 raid requests up

But that's changed, and I've seen requests from wayyy lower ranks than -20 from me. But it doesn't happen often... so, it's a mystery how it works. Oh, the same thing applies to friends, except that change #2 to "is on your friendlist"
What can I do to make sure I get some help next time?Well, remember to keep sending the help requests every 10 minutes. Even if nobody public gets to see your request, a friend might've logged in and might be inclined to help you.

But, most importantly... be in a competent Union. You can't re-request a Union help, but that's because you don't need to! Once requested, even offline Union members can join your raid once they login. That is by the far the most important aspect, even more so if you communicate with your Union members somehow... which today tends to mean Discord.
I got Aphrodite for my 1st SSR a few weeks back, so I have been running a water team with her, other water kami SR with 3LB,4LB lvl 80 illu as my main eido, and 2 SR water eido, and 3 rare water Eido. Then yesterday I managed to pull Fafnir and Dakku from the MJ gatcha. I'm thinking, since Fafnir can buff fire and water, I shoud use her for my main eido, then I won't have to use an all water eido team. Also, since she buffs two elements, I can put Dakku on my water team.

Any reason why I shouldn't do that?When you're still new, go ahead. But as you power up, Dakki won't do any damage herself because your weapons won't power her up. Use Water Assault weapons for your Water team. Or off-element SSRs when you're still new.

But don't use SR and R Water Eidolons. Only the MAIN and FRIEND Eidolons matter, so the rest are just for stats. Since even 0-star SSRs have so much more stats, use whatever ones you got from events in the five sub-slots.
EDIT: Oh right, Iluyanka requires you to use Water Eidolons for the boost. Hummm. I guess you don't have better, so you'll just have to suffer through some really pitiful base stats from Eidolons for a while...

Saeleyna

07-01-2018, 03:50 PM

I'm sure this has been asked/posted somewhere - did a quick search and didn't see anything - but can someone explain exactly what procs what defense buff and exactly how they were for the ice catastrophe raid? The number of times I've used an Eidolon which does normal damage, then use a full burst and do 2k each instead of normal 100-200k burst damage. I know she has defense buffs, but I don't understand where they all come from because half the time I use burst she's stunned, which means it's not from her burst attack. Additionally, I often see my entire front line do 0 damage but my back line do full damage which makes zero sense. Her defense mitigation just seems completely random and as a result I can't determine when I should burst or wait.

Unregistered

07-01-2018, 04:21 PM

The plain ol' defense buff that just reduces damage comes from her normal overdrive.

The giant damage cut shield that wastes 5 attacks comes from the first of her two special triggers. If you see her raging (or you yourself knock her into raging), then the first action she takes is that hit all attack that lowers your water resist and procs her shield.
Someone who has already connected to the fight, was around to see her enter raging mode, and then takes a turn? That shield gets procced.
Someone connects to the fight while she is in raging mode and then takes a turn? That shield gets procced.

Aidoru

07-01-2018, 04:29 PM

She has 2 defensive buffs. The first one is from her regular overdrive, it's just a defense buff, a strong one. The second is from her entering rage. Every time she enters rage, on her first turn in rage, she will use a party-wide attack that inflicts water res down and buffs herself with a defense icon buff that negates all regular and skill damage 5 times. Eidolon damage still goes through and a tiny bit of burst damage.

When other people are in, they will also trigger this when she hits rage, meaning it will occur multiple times for every person who decides to attacks.

If you're soloing (or if timed quickly enough with others in it), you can skip this if you push her into rage using a skill and then into stun without giving her a turn like say with a full burst or Thor's paralysis. If you're using say someone like Sol, you can also dispel it.

Slashley

07-01-2018, 04:42 PM

Bear

07-01-2018, 04:52 PM

If you're soloing (or if timed quickly enough with others in it), you can skip this if you push her into rage using a skill and then into stun without giving her a turn like say with a full burst or Thor's paralysis. If you're using say someone like Sol, you can also dispel it.

This is actually slightly off as just not too long ago we tested it out ourselves on DMM (For science!)

1. I started the raid, dps and stopped right before she rages, and abi her into rage (and proceeded to take out half the bar using abi only).
2. My union mates #1 and #2 joined.
3. #2 did a single nuke, then #1 finished off the rest of the rage bar with abi only.
4. I attacked. The Rage Trigger proc'd. So your theory (and mine too) is NG.
5. Next step, #1 attacked. Rage Trigger proc'd. Joining and then stunning with abi before moving is also NG.
6. Last step, #2 attacked. Rage Trigger did not proc.

Basing on this test run, it would seem that if you are not the one responsible for pushing the boss into mode change, it will not trigger the attack. ...At least this is what we thought. Later that day, Shade (or was it Blubbergott?) tested out our theory too. He repeated Union Mate #2's step, but the Rage Trigger proc'd. We raised the white flag from there. The only REAL way to skip it, is to force her to skip her turn using para or charm.

In the end, I think it's best that, whenever you see the boss in rage mode and not immobilized, just assume the worst and brace yourself for the Rage Trigger. OR, Just bring dispel.

Aidoru

07-01-2018, 04:53 PM

Hmm? Skip what? At least not the 100% damage cut shield, since even if you knock her out of Rage, the next time she gets a turn she will still do it... :neutral:

Does she? I'll have to double check next time I solo. I normally just have her use it since Sol basically solves everything for this fight for me.

Slashley

07-01-2018, 05:30 PM

Oh wait, you mean using an ability to trigger to Rage, then finishing off ALL of Rage without a single auto-attack? That's... rather specific. I... don't know what happens with that. I'd assume that it'd still trigger on the next turn, but that sounds like a situation that could bug.

I have just noticed that quite a few randoms have realized that it happens as the "first action of Rage", and such, hold back from attacking until after Rage. And then the fuckers Trigger the shield when you're not expecting it since Rage ended ages ago and you waste a full fucking burst. :cursing:

Aidoru

07-01-2018, 05:34 PM

This is actually slightly off as just not too long ago we tested it out ourselves on DMM (For science!)

1. I started the raid, dps and stopped right before she rages, and abi her into rage (and proceeded to take out half the bar using abi only).
2. My union mates #1 and #2 joined.
3. #2 did a single nuke, then #1 finished off the rest of the rage bar with abi only.
4. I attacked. The Rage Trigger proc'd. So your theory (and mine too) is NG.
5. Next step, #1 attacked. Rage Trigger proc'd. Joining and then stunning with abi before moving is also NG.
6. Last step, #2 attacked. Rage Trigger did not proc.

Basing on this test run, it would seem that if you are not the one responsible for pushing the boss into mode change, it will not trigger the attack. ...At least this is what we thought. Later that day, Shade (or was it Blubbergott?) tested out our theory too. He repeated Union Mate #2's step, but the Rage Trigger proc'd. We raised the white flag from there. The only REAL way to skip it, is to force her to skip her turn using para or charm.

In the end, I think it's best that, whenever you see the boss in rage mode and not immobilized, just assume the worst and brace yourself for the Rage Trigger. OR, Just bring dispel.

So simply getting her into rage will trigger her to activate the damage negating skill at the end of your turn regardless of how many phases have passed via yourself or other players? I see, that's good to know. So if someone chose to wait from their first turn of it in rage all the way until others pushed it back into regular phase, it would still activate and probably screw someone up.

Cobblemaniac

07-01-2018, 07:49 PM

So simply getting her into rage will trigger her to activate the damage negating skill at the end of your turn regardless of how many phases have passed via yourself or other players? I see, that's good to know. So if someone chose to wait from their first turn of it in rage all the way until others pushed it back into regular phase, it would still activate and probably screw someone up.

That update that shifts the visible buffs forward probably will help a ton in raids like these.

That, or everyone who's capable enough opts for soloing water rag.

MagicSpice

07-01-2018, 07:59 PM

That update that shifts the visible buffs forward probably will help a ton in raids like these.

That, or everyone who's capable enough opts for soloing water rag.

i'm hoping that comes soon... you can click on their HP bar to see all buffs and debuffs, but that takes time and since debuffs you cause are on a timer.... not good...

Ikki

07-01-2018, 08:03 PM

That update that shifts the visible buffs forward probably will help a ton in raids like these.

That, or everyone who's capable enough opts for soloing water rag.

If you understand well how water rag works and your own dps, shes very easy and manageable, waaaay easier than wind rag and easier for me compared to trag, cause trag still has huge spike dmg and auto dmg, meanwhile water rag damage is laughable (if you know what you are doing).

Cobblemaniac

07-01-2018, 08:18 PM

If you understand well how water rag works and your own dps, shes very easy and manageable, waaaay easier than wind rag and easier for me compared to trag, cause trag still has huge spike dmg and auto dmg, meanwhile water rag damage is laughable (if you know what you are doing).

I can see why. Discounting her 2 snakes, she's one of the most wet noodle catastrophes out there (lol that rage overdrive). And you could just as easily replace the 2 dead himes soooo...

The more accurate description of water rag is probably just annoying...

i'm hoping that comes soon... you can click on their HP bar to see all buffs and debuffs, but that takes time and since debuffs you cause are on a timer.... not good...

Yeah... no. There's that, but clicking around takes away almost 5-10 precious seconds on your debuff timer. Not to mention random players will consistently trigger buffs once you hit a count of 6+ players...

Still better off being selfish and soloing. Or being lazy and leaving everything to 15 players is fine if afk is your thing.

Double post edit:

10619

Breaze.

10620

Kureru

07-02-2018, 01:22 AM

How's that new inventory button. If you want to sell 200 different weapons it takes one less click, if you want to enhance 20 different weapons it takes 40 more clicks :sad:

Slashley

07-02-2018, 01:29 AM

How's that new inventory button. If you want to sell 200 different weapons it takes one less click, if you want to enhance 20 different weapons it takes 40 more clicks :sad:For the latter, use the back button in your mouse.

Aidoru

07-02-2018, 01:30 AM

I dislike it. When enhancing hoards of SR weapons for skill leveling, I use to click the enhance button, on the left, right after accepting the mats to enhance to skip the leveling animation to quickly go to the next weapon. Now I have to deal with two loading screen clicking the inventory button and enhance button to take you to the enhance menu, so now it's faster to just wait for the leveling animation to finish. Meaning the past slow is the new fast and the new UI is the new slow. Meh.

Slashley

07-02-2018, 01:36 AM

Kureru

07-02-2018, 01:44 AM

Use the back button! On your mouse if you're not using the (dreadful) mobile version.

Just like when pulling Gem Gacha, Draw 10 -> back -> repeat.

Thanks for this. I had to bind it in autohotkey since my mouse lacks this arcane "back" button, but it should save a lot of time

Yolodesu

07-02-2018, 01:49 AM

Oh wait, you mean using an ability to trigger to Rage, then finishing off ALL of Rage without a single auto-attack? That's... rather specific. I... don't know what happens with that. I'd assume that it'd still trigger on the next turn, but that sounds like a situation that could bug.

It doesn't bug and that's the proper way to do it imo. This way, her shield always trigger during stun. You just need 1 dispell for her def buff, and remove her shield with auto-attack. Since she takes no damage, it's 1 extra turn in stun = 1 turn gained on your abi cd.

Ikki

07-02-2018, 01:51 AM

It doesn't bug and that's the proper way to do it imo. This way, her shield always trigger during stun. You just need 1 dispell for her def buff, and remove her shield with auto-attack. Since she takes no damage, it's 1 extra turn in stun = 1 turn gained on your abi cd.

ugh ill pass on that, i want mvps, waiting out raging phase wont get me that XD

Yolodesu

07-02-2018, 02:00 AM

ugh ill pass on that, i want mvps, waiting out raging phase wont get me that XD

Yeah, i mean, it's the way to do it if you're solo. When i'm joining (which happens rarely), i just go yolo.

Ikki

07-02-2018, 02:03 AM

Yeah, i mean, it's the way to do it if you're solo. When i'm joining (which happens rarely), i just go yolo.

ah you mean for solo, for solo you just burst her from raging to stun in 1 go using CM to remove the 5 dmg cuts if your burst is ready, if its not you auto once and burst, CM should be up again by the time she uses her normal ougi (defense up) since her stun phase isnt as short as trag.

Aidoru

07-02-2018, 02:11 AM

Use the back button! On your mouse if you're not using the (dreadful) mobile version.

Just like when pulling Gem Gacha, Draw 10 -> back -> repeat.

I actually disabled it a while back because I kept accidentally clicking it, causing some annoyances. Guess I'll have to key bind back it later.

Yolodesu

07-02-2018, 02:15 AM

ah you mean for solo, for solo you just burst her from raging to stun in 1 go using CM to remove the 5 dmg cuts if your burst is ready, if its not you auto once and burst, CM should be up again by the time she uses her normal ougi (defense up) since her stun phase isnt as short as trag.

Or, you push her trough rage phase with an abi, and stun her with a burst. The shield procs after your burst, during stun phase, and you don't even need to dispell it.

And i don't even bring cm. In my case it's Sol's alfrodull, which is 7t cd

Ikki

07-02-2018, 02:19 AM

Or, you push her trough rage phase with an abi, and stun her with a burst. The shield procs after your burst, during stun phase, and you don't even need to dispell it.

And i don't even bring cm. In my case it's Sol's alfrodull, which is 7t cd

That too, still i dont have sol and i wouldnt bring her anyways, shes too much dmg lost, i wouldnt solo warag under 9 mins with her and you dont even need heal for the laughable dmg water rag does.

Yolodesu

07-02-2018, 02:26 AM

That too, still i dont have sol and i wouldnt bring her anyways, shes too much dmg lost, i wouldnt solo warag under 9 mins with her and you dont even need heal for the laughable dmg water rag does.

It's not a damage loss for me since my thunder team sucks :angry:
To be fair, aside from light and wind, all my teams sucks :sad:

(i'm using light for most of the content*)

Cobblemaniac

07-02-2018, 05:39 AM

10622

Well. There’s our new summer hime.

Unregistered

07-02-2018, 05:40 AM

Hi, which of the new fire weapons is best to aim for? My current team is Mordred/Yatagarasu/Motu/Mars/Brunhildr with Belial. Should I go for a Mordred weapon or switch things up? Thanks

Cobblemaniac

07-02-2018, 05:42 AM

Hi, which of the new fire weapons is best to aim for? My current team is Mordred/Yatagarasu/Motu/Mars/Brunhildr with Belial. Should I go for a Mordred weapon or switch things up? Thanks

The best ones to go for at the moment are either Hercules’ assault weapon, on in the future Shingen’s assault weapon.

Slashley

07-02-2018, 06:31 AM

The best ones to go for at the moment are either Hercules’ assault weapon, on in the future Shingen’s assault weapon.I agree on the Herc one, but is Shingen good for Fire?

Shingen is basically a weaker Herc, but she'll start at 30 burst after her bursts. That makes her good for chaingun burst builds, but not really otherwise. I guess Fire could handle it with Ares... and Uriel? And then you'd need... Amaterasu and Mars for debuffs? Would it even work since Uriel spends her tokens on burst? And you can't fit Svarog into a team like that...

I dunno, I have difficulty seeing Shingen thrive outside of Wind which has massive amounts of high-burst generation Hime.

Cobblemaniac

07-02-2018, 06:37 AM

I agree on the Herc one, but is Shingen good for Fire?

Shingen is basically a weaker Herc, but she'll start at 30 burst after her bursts. That makes her good for chaingun burst builds, but not really otherwise. I guess Fire could handle it with Ares... and Uriel? And then you'd need... Amaterasu and Mars for debuffs? Would it even work since Uriel spends her tokens on burst? And you can't fit Svarog into a team like that...

I dunno, I have difficulty seeing Shingen thrive outside of Wind which has massive amounts of high-burst generation Hime.

... Ah. I forgot fire doesn't really work like wind does :sweat:

Frelas

07-02-2018, 08:56 AM

Laventale

07-02-2018, 09:04 AM

I have 2 questions
I had never much luck with getting ssr kamihime, and was forced to build on a sr team(light team), now finally i have gotten 2 ssr water kamihime (on fire rate up gache, rate up is a lie)
I have improved my water weapon grid but the light weapon grid is still stronger.
Is it better to roll on water rate up gacha trying to get another water ssr while having a increased risk of getting a dupe or should i roll on a light rate up gacha trying to get light ssr kamihime, so that i have 2 decent teams and have less risk of getting a dupe?
My second question
We can now roll again for limited summer kamihime, how many limited summer kamihime are in the gacha at the moment?

There aren't that many Limited Kamihimes, go into the Kamihime Wiki (http://kamihime-project.wikia.com/wiki/Kamihime) and click the "Limited" tab. Plus, we were bound to have another Water limited Kami but Nutaku skipped the Walkure Romance collab so we don't know if she will see the light anytime soon.

asianstuff

07-02-2018, 03:53 PM

At least up until May, no. So not for the next 10 months at least in the English version.

There's just so many mythos to pull from, I guess they just weren't popular enough and DMM just forgot about them.

That's a shame. I kinda like the idea of pairing Kamehime, Souls and Eidolons with others related to them. Amaterasu, Susanoo and Kushinada for example. Though, admittedly, 2 of the 3 are pretty messedd up.

Unregistered

07-02-2018, 05:15 PM

I agree on the Herc one, but is Shingen good for Fire?

Shingen is basically a weaker Herc, but she'll start at 30 burst after her bursts. That makes her good for chaingun burst builds, but not really otherwise. I guess Fire could handle it with Ares... and Uriel? And then you'd need... Amaterasu and Mars for debuffs? Would it even work since Uriel spends her tokens on burst? And you can't fit Svarog into a team like that...

I dunno, I have difficulty seeing Shingen thrive outside of Wind which has massive amounts of high-burst generation Hime.

Water? I mean it might just be because of the himes I currently have (don't have that many SSR outside of water), but with Sarasvati, Asherah, and Aphrodite bursts happen super quick. Sniper shot on Shingen + Ryu-oh cover decent debuffs to boot. I'm sure it's not optimal but given those are the only SSR water himes I have.....

VeryVoodoo

07-02-2018, 05:28 PM

MagicSpice

07-02-2018, 08:04 PM

Cobblemaniac

07-02-2018, 08:12 PM

that kinda reminds me.... how good would eidolons with DA/TA rate up and the rush/village (translations say village is TA) be for burst builds?

this is of course considering the eidolons also give elem atk (like Tiamat) and the weapons have assault with them

next union raid, i should be able to get Shingen so i'm starting to look into this stuff

Not sure about weapons, but I don't feel like I trust them lol.

Icarus seems to really do a good job of boosting combo though, and iirc I've seen quite a couple of DMM players run her in sub for their quests, no surprise considering her atk stats.

Double post edit:

10624

Umm. Can anyone provide screenshots from the SFW site just to compare? I'm interested to see how they look like.

Bear

07-02-2018, 08:30 PM

village

....It's 'Barrage'

Unregistered

07-02-2018, 08:57 PM

Ohh, they did change the art used on the .com side. Ok, so when you look at a kamihime's page on the wiki, you see a section that google calls 'Overall picture'? And there's a 'Browser version' image and 'Application version' image you can click on the plus signs to expand? The .com side of the game got switched to the 'Application version'.

Ikki

07-02-2018, 08:59 PM

Icarus seems to really do a good job of boosting combo though, and iirc I've seen quite a couple of DMM players run her in sub for their quests, no surprise considering her atk stats.

Icarus is used mainly for her high stats, her active is just a bonus cause its not as high as you would expect, but its still there XD

MagicSpice

07-02-2018, 09:04 PM

....It's 'Barrage'

i knew something was wrong with google translate there...

Cobblemaniac

07-02-2018, 09:13 PM

Saeleyna

07-02-2018, 09:15 PM

Quick numbers question - I'm currently using Shingen for a burst comp but she's equipped with Storm Bow Alvand which lowers def. Would it be +DPS to have her burst solo first set for the def down then use provisional forest for a full burst on the 2nd burst cycle? Or just use provisional forest from the get go? I currently have 2 def downs in my party not counting bow (sniper shot + Ryu-Oh).

Cobblemaniac

07-02-2018, 09:19 PM

Option 1 works better with Arthur (which is why you will see some people running Arthur with Hercules' Axe). With Shingen, I suggest you simply run full burst so you don't waste 4+ turns and another...

MagicSpice

07-02-2018, 10:06 PM

honestly, it's preferred that you have your debuffs covered so you don't need to rely on bursts to do that for you...

bonus points to wind builds cause a friend 100% wind eidolon ironically comes with a def debuff, which is able to get instantly cast if they actually are your friend

Bear

07-02-2018, 10:19 PM

Cobblemaniac

07-02-2018, 11:05 PM

Wrong. If your burst can cover def down, use that instead of wasting a slot for debuffer hime that does shit dmg. You want to maximize performance, your BiS options when building an end game team are always gonna be Fast Burst > Nukes > Mitigation > Debuff. If your weapon burst or support summon can cast Def down, use it. The less buttons you need to waste to achieve enough debuff the better.

Having a hard time piecing together the complete picture of why that's the case (the team building priority), but here's how I understand it:

Debuff is the lowest priority given how many skills need to be used to set those up, and not to mention there's a lot of content out there that's so debuff unfriendly it's practically a waste of time to rely on those.

Mitigation to survive those overdrives if we can't knock them out of rage phase/ kill them fast enough.

Burst does more damage than nukes(?), but we probably can piece them together and say both are vital in stomping through enemies before they land a skill on you.

Which basically means if a debuff-centric hime doesn't do damage... don't include her in an end game team unless her mechanic literally breaks the content you're challenging harder than another hime you would've included?

Also, where do heals and orb reduction belong in this list?

Bear

07-02-2018, 11:25 PM

QXZ

07-02-2018, 11:41 PM

@Bear,

i have 3 Light SSR's right now. i also got 50k jewels which i plan on blowing it when the 100% light eido comes out / when Artemis comes out.

my question is: for my next mtix, would you suggest that i continue to pick up future light SSR himes or should i start building a dark team?

thanks

MagicSpice

07-02-2018, 11:43 PM

Burst > Nuke because Nuke has CD. Burst depends on how fast you can get your entire team to burst, and if you're doing it right, you can burst as fast as if not faster than a Nuke's CD would tick. Obviously, by burst I mean FB.

Healing / Delay / Counter all goes to Mitigation.

Debuff is lowest priority because it is merely a necessity. Once you've achieved enough of it, there is no more room to grow. Long story short: Debuff = Low Ceiling. Raw Dmg Dealing abilities / buff = High Ceiling. You'd wanna increase that ceiling for your team as much as possible, this is why debuff has the least priority.

i think i get a bit of that at least... even without debuffng on enemies, i can still pull off a lot of damage with hime that have very strong damaging abilities cause they are just that, loads of damage that just capitalize more on buffs... (or teams like my fire one that have loads of buffing methods, both AoE and self buffing)

in fact, it's why i actually like pairing someone like bastet with nepthys cause of those buffs adding boost after boost on the damage she can toss out.

it makes sense anyway given that there's far more ways to increase damage and stats compared to lowering them.

Yolodesu

07-03-2018, 03:03 AM

Is there a list for gem quest hours somewhere? If not, i would be able to share some and i would be glad if ppl could complete it.

Cobblemaniac

07-03-2018, 03:22 AM

Is there a list for gem quest hours somewhere? If not, i would be able to share some and i would be glad if ppl could complete it.

10625

Convert timezone accordingly.

I simply made a notepad in my desktop reminding me of the gem quest times in my own timezone.

Yolodesu

07-03-2018, 03:27 AM

Perfect. Ty mate!

Slashley

07-03-2018, 03:47 AM

Water? I mean it might just be because of the himes I currently have (don't have that many SSR outside of water), but with Sarasvati, Asherah, and Aphrodite bursts happen super quick. Sniper shot on Shingen + Ryu-oh cover decent debuffs to boot. I'm sure it's not optimal but given those are the only SSR water himes I have.....That could work, yes. Saraswati is extremely disappointing for a SSR though, and is literally only good for supporting PF builds.

Notice that your build will be very unreliable when compared to Wind chaingun bursting, though. Aphrodite is "only" 20% trpl+, and Saraswati is 50% combo+ to two characters. So you're strongly at the mercy of RNG. Asherah can give +20 burst to all and Saraswati 25 to one person (and herself), but neither of these compare to the ludicrous amounts of burst generation that Wind has access to (SSR Cybele all the time, Titania with very short but yet extremely potent buffs, Chulainn with a long CD but extreme burst generation).
Icarus is used mainly for her high stats, her active is just a bonus cause its not as high as you would expect, but its still there XD... do we know what the bonus is? To my understanding we only know Hime values, and some Soul values that have been compared to the known Hime values.

Ikki

07-03-2018, 04:11 AM

do we know what the bonus is? To my understanding we only know Hime values, and some Soul values that have been compared to the known Hime values.

Its still an unknown value in the wiki, it doesnt feel high tho so its prob 10% or something like that, could be even lower, still good enough and you can stack it with other TA buffs.

Saeleyna

07-03-2018, 07:17 AM

[QUOTE=Slashley;121392]That could work, yes. Saraswati is extremely disappointing for a SSR though, and is literally only good for supporting PF builds.

Notice that your build will be very unreliable when compared to Wind chaingun bursting, though. Aphrodite is "only" 20% trpl+, and Saraswati is 50% combo+ to two characters. So you're strongly at the mercy of RNG. Asherah can give +20 burst to all and Saraswati 25 to one person (and herself), but neither of these compare to the ludicrous amounts of burst generation that Wind has access to (SSR Cybele all the time, Titania with very short but yet extremely potent buffs, Chulainn with a long CD but extreme burst generation)....

Ofc - wasn't trying to imply this was a top tier build by any means, more that depending on what Kamihime you have access to Shingen could still be optimal. At least, she seems to be based on the amount of time I've used her (was using Andromeda stall comp before with double team heals + sarasvati heal). These just happen to be the only 4 water SSR kamihime I have access to so gotta work with what I'm given.

Cobblemaniac

07-04-2018, 02:57 AM

Can someone help me check my team building progress so far? These are my current builds:

All teams don't have relic yet.

Water
Team: Mord SS Snow Raphy SSR Nike Cthulhu A-Sol front, A-Gaia Oceanus back
Assault: 116% (No off-element weapons)
Defender: 42% (No off-element)
Pride: 1 maxed

Remaining (useable) himes: Ea (lol), Triton, Belphegor, Kikurihime, Atalanta, Anahit, W-Boreas(???)

Light
Team: D'Art BP Belebog Raphael A-Sol SSR Nike front, A-Gaia Anteros back
Assault: 79.5% (+10% water)
Defender: 26% (+16% water)
Pride: 2 maxed

Remaining (useable) himes: Uranus, Kamadeva(???), Djehuti (yes, this one will be in soon, she's a recent pull)

Wind
Team: Mord SS A-Gaia Hastur W-Orpheus A-Sol front, Zephyrus Cybele back
Assault: 82.5 % (no off)
Defender: 25.5% (no off)
Pride: 1 maxed, 1 lvl 18

Remaining (useable) himes: Ithaqhua, Hermes(???), Caspiel(???)

Fire

No existing teams or weapons at the moment.

Viable himes are: Ares (not awakened yet), Amaterasu, Hephaestus, Ragaraja, Brynhildr, Amon(???), Agni, Motu, Konohana (probably obsolete other than in R-only quests at this point).

Thunder has Raiko, Hermod and Krishna only. No weapons.

Dark has Eligos, Hypnos, Rangda and Pharol. No weapons.

Any tips continuing forward are much appreciated :bgrin:

Slashley

07-04-2018, 06:07 AM

The most important thing is to keep pulling daily Gem Gacha and keep upping those Grids. Aside from Water, you still have a long journey in all of them - and even in Water, you should probably cut back on a pure Defender weapon (or two) and replace it(/them) with SR Assault(s).

You will have a decent Fire team as soon you get some weapons. Keep farming Ult Fire for those Lances and grab the Herc weapon, Ares+Amaterasu+Heph will form you a solid core. At least when you get around to Awakening Ares, that is. Then the last slot will be Bryn/Amon/Agni depending on content, I guess. Heck, with Herc, you can probably drop Heph even. And yes, Konohana is useless to you but only because you have Amaterasu.

Your Thunder team will be okay and carried hard by Raiko, assuming you keep farming Ult Thunder for the Axes and Dartagnan's HP weapon. Bring Sol and you'll have an... extremely defensive Thunder build. Huh.

For now, your Dark is hopeless. Pray to RNG gods to grant you something that can carry you. Even if that doesn't happen, your Water team should be able to handle every Light event just fine, no worries.

Cobblemaniac

07-04-2018, 09:27 AM