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View Full Version : The loots difference betwen difficulty



TNinja
06-01-2017, 05:37 PM
Anybody can differentiate the difference betwen each difficulty? So people can decide which stage is more efficient?

QXZ
06-01-2017, 06:14 PM
from my limited experience of testing out beginner, standard and expert in the previous event (Rahab). it seems that the higher the difficulty the more drops per AP spent for every single type of material.

TNinja
06-01-2017, 07:04 PM
I found clearing standard and beginner gave tons of upgradeable items where clearing expert rarely do so and often did not drop any. I'm not certain about expert is more efficient than standard and ultimate more efficient than expert. We will wait another poster to give their opinions or facts.

Unregistered
06-01-2017, 08:44 PM
standard drops gold chest for me and beginner doesn't.
higher difficulty have more drops
when i run beginner i have 1-4 drops, standard 2-7 drops, expert 2-8? drops.

sanahtlig
06-01-2017, 09:14 PM
In general, you'll get more for your AP out of higher difficulties. Don't forget that Expert and Ultimate have a chance to drop rainbow chests with SR or SSR non-enhancement items. Also, Ultimate drops a ton of SR enhancement materials, which are far more valuable than the Rs.

QXZ
06-01-2017, 09:33 PM
i dont think i ever gotten a rainbow chest. and or maybe i did get one and it was a rahab orb.... >.<

Aidoru
06-01-2017, 09:46 PM
Beginner is a complete waste, don't even bother aside from clearing once for jewels. You get up to like 4 or 5 chests with a chance of only like 2 at lowest and rarely any silver or gold tier materials, mostly just iron (the grayer color background one) and bronze mats. Only R rarity enhance material and to make it worse is you can get low grade break limit material like the lithographs, wasting even more chances at event materials because you totally need low tier break material right?

Standard is just as bad but you'll at least be able to get some gold tier mat, at a low rate.

Ultimate is by far the best AP to chest ratio and rate of getting gold tier mats because not only much better drop quantity but more trash mobs to add. The only real problems with ultimate is if you can not handle it and the rate of getting iron tier mats can be pretty random/low, but the sheer amount of chests you get honestly take care of that. You'll get a ridiculous amount of bronze mats and plenty silver/gold. Only SR enhance materials as well.

If you can't handle ultimate, then run expert.

QXZ
06-01-2017, 09:59 PM
i m curious but wat does ragarok drop?

Aidoru
06-01-2017, 10:11 PM
Less than Ultimate since you don't even get any trash mobs which drop a good amount of the bronze chests for you in ultimate. And I can't say for sure since I've only cleared it once but guessing high rate for at least 1 plat chest which gives you a core. Would assume you're guaranteed for at least 1 to drop considering you can only run once a day, if not, then welp.

TNinja
06-01-2017, 11:15 PM
Beginner is a complete waste, don't even bother aside from clearing once for jewels. You get up to like 4 or 5 chests with a chance of only like 2 at lowest and rarely any silver or gold tier materials, mostly just iron (the grayer color background one) and bronze mats. Only R rarity enhance material and to make it worse is you can get low grade break limit material like the lithographs, wasting even more chances at event materials because you totally need low tier break material right?

Standard is just as bad but you'll at least be able to get some gold tier mat, at a low rate.

Ultimate is by far the best AP to chest ratio and rate of getting gold tier mats because not only much better drop quantity but more trash mobs to add. The only real problems with ultimate is if you can not handle it and the rate of getting iron tier mats can be pretty random/low, but the sheer amount of chests you get honestly take care of that. You'll get a ridiculous amount of bronze mats and plenty silver/gold. Only SR enhance materials as well.

If you can't handle ultimate, then run expert.

I'm taking it slowly the idea to challenge ultimate hasn't crossed my mind yet also losing 40 ap seems quite steep for trying.
Prolly will try later when i have enough time.

Unregistered
06-02-2017, 12:14 PM
Can anyone give an estimate of an approximate Attack power that can reliably beat ultimate difficulty without needing an Elixer? (Assuming a neutral element team running Sol + Andromeda)

Wanderer
06-02-2017, 01:05 PM
Can anyone give an estimate of an approximate Attack power that can reliably beat ultimate difficulty without needing an Elixer? (Assuming a neutral element team running Sol + Andromeda)

27k?
Just a wild guess as weapon and eido skills could make huge difference.
Best way to find out is to give it a try, just remember bring some Type A debuffs (like Jeanne w/ ambush).

AgentFakku
06-02-2017, 01:18 PM
I can't even do ultimate or expert w/o spending a jewel. a noob here... Been farming Standard like for every event so far

QXZ
06-02-2017, 05:55 PM
@HungryHunter

i m ~23k atk using gilgamesh. i can only do Expert when a friend has SSR eidolon available.
once i deplete my supply of SSR eidolons, i just go standard and drink half elixirs.

but if u did the last raid event, you prolly has 30 or so half elixirs for use about now.

TNinja
06-02-2017, 11:15 PM
Can anyone give an estimate of an approximate Attack power that can reliably beat ultimate difficulty without needing an Elixer? (Assuming a neutral element team running Sol + Andromeda)

I think it is not much. Still it is depend on your team. The damage of ixion double attack can cause more than ten thousands. So your party at least has hp more than five thousands. 6k or 7k is the recommended hp. Well debuff can fix that.

arphael
06-03-2017, 04:06 AM
Can anyone give an estimate of an approximate Attack power that can reliably beat ultimate difficulty without needing an Elixer? (Assuming a neutral element team running Sol + Andromeda)

im on wind team, 29k atk power with Nemesis eido(SR eido with 20% atk)
andro, no KH SSR, no SSR weap, all wind weap (2 atk, 8 hp)
lol :D

clear ultimate with ease

edit: all SR weap

TNinja
06-03-2017, 07:27 AM
im on wind team, 29k atk power with Nemesis eido(SR eido with 20% atk)
andro, no KH SSR, no SSR weap, all wind weap (2 atk, 8 hp)
lol :D

clear ultimate with ease

edit: all SR weap
To collect all wind weapon needs time espescially luck. The elemental raid boss rarely drop it. It was my mistake consuming 2 fire SR weapons where you need tons of it to create cheap mono element.

- - - Updated - - -

For wind water and lightning look easy because they can grind it in exchange material.

sanahtlig
06-03-2017, 08:20 AM
For wind water and lightning look easy because they can grind it in exchange material.
The Wind shop SR weapon is the only one that's even potentially useful (assault skill), and as I recall you can't max limit break even a single copy. Daily disaster farming is the best way to strengthen your weapon arsenal outside of events. Starting your own 20AP fight and soloing it results in a far higher drop rate than joining the raids of others. In any 3-month cycle, the number of SR+ weapons you can collect from events is limited. Supplementing with Disaster farming is essential if you want to reach your team's potential in a reasonable timeframe.

TNinja
06-03-2017, 08:54 AM
The Wind shop SR weapon is the only one that's even potentially useful (assault skill), and as I recall you can't max limit break even a single copy. Daily disaster farming is the best way to strengthen your weapon arsenal outside of events. Starting your own 20AP fight and soloing it results in a far higher drop rate than joining the raids of others. In any 3-month cycle, the number of SR+ weapons you can collect from events is limited. Supplementing with Disaster farming is essential if you want to reach your team's potential in a reasonable timeframe.
Why you can't MLB it?
Well Still without MLB the effect is enough and rarely people Maxing it anyway furthermore this is not even an SSR weapon
Eventhough the drop rate maybe higher the restriction made it hard. 3 attempt each day for normal quest, well expert very rarely dropping weapons. The problem comes because the assault weapon itself only one where the other 2 or 3 are defender for fire. I considering to make a dummy account to create fire raid. Perhaps not now

arphael
06-03-2017, 10:03 AM
To collect all wind weapon needs time espescially luck. The elemental raid boss rarely drop it. It was my mistake consuming 2 fire SR weapons where you need tons of it to create cheap mono element.

- - - Updated - - -

For wind water and lightning look easy because they can grind it in exchange material.

I using 2 dummy acc to start raid lol
drop SR weap so easiy

sanahtlig
06-03-2017, 10:10 AM
Why you can't MLB it?
As I recall, you're limited to one copy fewer than is necessary to MLB the weapon.

lightwolf
06-03-2017, 04:48 PM
All i know is that you should do the highest level you can do in advent battles.
As far as powering up the best way is indeed the disaster raids. If memory serves there are 3 weapons per raid, 2 will have hp increase (Defender) and 1 will have attack increase (Assault). And the eidos that come from the raids are some of the best SRs as far as overall usability. As always you should figure out 1 or 2 elements to focus on in the beginning. This is doubly so if you are new and not wanting to invest money into the game. Don't spend your materials on the weapons and eidos from the stores. You're better off using those for elixirs and seeds. The best way to gain power is to keep active, participate in events and do raids when not doing events.

Aidoru
06-03-2017, 05:30 PM
Raid eidolons are some of the worst, don't use them unless you have no other option. Story exchange eidolons are just as bad but they can at least provide you with battle buffs, but that doesn't require using as a main.

It'll take less effort to max out a R eidolon that'll have decently good stats for beginners to use than it would take to level a raid eidolon to be worth using and only be slightly stronger than that R despite being 30 levels higher.

For example:
Werewolf, a dark R eidolon, easily farmable from certain story missions, 900 ATK at Lv60 (max) and gives 30% Dark ATK boost when maxed if using as main.
Dark Disaster, the dark SR raid boss eidolon (or any disaster works, they all have the same stats), 1000 ATK at Lv90, that's 30 levels worth of enhancing just for 100 more ATK and even at max break, it's only 20% ATK and HP. And this is assuming you can even manage to fully break limit it before you get something else worth using.

Unless you really need that HP, which is unlikely if you're still at the stage where you'd use Disaster eidolons as a main. As a sub, uh, go ahead I guess.

As for the main topic, after a little data recording.

My AP per chest rates are:
Beginner - 2.5
Standard - 2.4
Expert - 2
Ultimate - 1.70

Of course it's not the most accurate, I have barely any runs in Beginner, Standard and Expert as I'm using my alt for those. I'm not wasting any AP on my main for it, which only runs Ultimate and Ragnarok.

lightwolf
06-03-2017, 06:02 PM
Raid eidolons are some of the worst, don't use them unless you have no other option. Story exchange eidolons are just as bad but they can at least provide you with battle buffs.

It'll take less effort to max out a R eidolon that'll have decently good stats for beginners to use than it would take to level a raid eidolon to be worth using and only be slightly stronger than that R despite being 30 levels higher.

For example:
Werewolf, a dark R eidolon, easily farmable from certain story missions, 900 ATK at Lv60 (max) and gives 30% Dark ATK boost when maxed if using as main.
Dark Disaster, the dark SR raid boss eidolon (or any disaster works, they all have the same stats), 1000 ATK at Lv90, that's 30 levels worth of enhancing just for 100 more ATK and even at max break, it's only 20% ATK and HP. And this is assuming you can even manage to fully break limit it before you get something else worth using.

First off let me say that i have little experience with the Rare eidos so i can't say for certain about them. But let me just say that 100 extra attack is a lot more than that. I'm not exactly certain of the calculations but if I'm not misunderstanding the formula that 100 attack will have all the % increases from all the Assault weapon and the Eidos. Every little bit helps. Also don't underestimate the extra HP. While the dream is to just have a boat load of attack to annihilate the enemy most beginners don't have that so the extra HP is extra survival/chance to kill the boss. Also you will get the disasters while you are farming the weapons, which are necessary for the extra stats that most beginners don't have. Am I saying that the Disasters are good? No, by no means are they optimal. But if you don't have good options they may be the best of the pile that you have. Also most experienced players will have event eidos that are vastly superior to the Disasters. So this is aimed at new players that want to run all elements. My advice remains as i said earlier. Try to get 2 elements, your main and one to cover your mains weakness (if there is one). Hopefully luck is on your side and you get good Kamis and eidos. But if not the disasters make a decent bandaid.
This is just for new players though and completely based on my experiences.


My AP per chest rates are:
Beginner - 2.5
Standard - 2.4
Expert - 2
Ultimate - 1.70

These are probably not too far off. However the big point is that chests are not equal. 2 bronze chests might be better than 2 silver chests depending on what you need and what they drop.

This all being said the best thing to do is experiment. Find what works for you. This is what I've found with my experiments. Sometimes more attack is not the answer. Just look at the ragna Ixion. I'm not sure about anybody else but i doubt there is anyone currently that can just use lots of attack to kill it. It takes strategy and the ability to survive. Doesn't matter how much attack you have if you can be nuked out of existence.

jazz154
06-03-2017, 06:17 PM
First off let me say that i have little experience with the Rare eidos so i can't say for certain about them. But let me just say that 100 extra attack is a lot more than that. I'm not exactly certain of the calculations but if I'm not misunderstanding the formula that 100 attack will have all the % increases from all the Assault weapon and the Eidos. Every little bit helps. Also don't underestimate the extra HP. While the dream is to just have a boat load of attack to annihilate the enemy most beginners don't have that so the extra HP is extra survival/chance to kill the boss. Also you will get the disasters while you are farming the weapons, which are necessary for the extra stats that most beginners don't have. Am I saying that the Disasters are good? No, by no means are they optimal. But if you don't have good options they may be the best of the pile that you have. Also most experienced players will have event eidos that are vastly superior to the Disasters. So this is aimed at new players that want to run all elements. My advice remains as i said earlier. Try to get 2 elements, your main and one to cover your mains weakness (if there is one). Hopefully luck is on your side and you get good Kamis and eidos. But if not the disasters make a decent bandaid.

The thing is that it isn't worth leveling daily raid eidolons. That 100 atk won't do a thing. In the end you will get better things from events.
Plus I will take extra 10% atk up over 20% hp up any time of the day. So R eidolon is better in my opinion since it can have 30% instead of 20%.

lightwolf
06-03-2017, 06:59 PM
The thing is that it isn't worth leveling daily raid eidolons. That 100 atk won't do a thing. In the end you will get better things from events.
Plus I will take extra 10% atk up over 20% hp up any time of the day. So R eidolon is better in my opinion since it can have 30% instead of 20%.

Yea fair enough, i was just trying to offer some ideas. But if the agreed upon thing is that attack trumps all that's probably better. Just offering my experiences, limited as they may be.

I'm curious though as where people value HP. Is an extra 10% attack better than 20% HP? Or is the problem that the disasters are harder to farm, because in my experience when i'm trying to farm weapons from the raids they show up more than i care to see them. Or are the rare eidos just that easy to farm. Like i said i started back in Apocalypse so i have very limited experience with rares cause i used Diabolos cause the 10% attack and hp for all seemed good. Now i have all the event eidos and lots of weapons so i don't have much experience starting later with harder events.

Aidoru
06-03-2017, 07:27 PM
These are probably not too far off. However the big point is that chests are not equal. 2 bronze chests might be better than 2 silver chests depending on what you need and what they drop.

Again, just to state, I am missing a lot of data for Beginner, Standard and Expert.


"Others" = low grade break enhance materials

Beginner
2.5 AP per chest

Chest Rarity Rates
Plat - 0.00%
Gold - 0.00%
Silver - 38.46%
Bronze - 61.54%

Material Rates
Gold - 0.00%
Silver - 0.00%
Bronze - 34.62%
Iron - 19.23%
Enhance - 42.31%
Plat - 0%
Other - 3.85%


Standard
2.4 AP per chest

Chest Rarity Rates
Plat - 0.00%
Gold - 11.76%
Silver - 23.53%
Bronze - 64.71%

Material Rates
Gold - 5.88%
Silver - 14.71%
Bronze - 35.29%
Iron - 26.47%
Enhance - 14.71%
Plat - 0%
Other - 2.94%


Expert
2 AP per chest

Chest Rarity Rates
Plat -0.00%
Gold - 8.79%
Silver - 39.56%
Bronze - 51.65%

Material Rates
Gold - 8.79%
Silver - 23.08%
Bronze - 25.27%
Iron - 25.27%
Enhance - 16.48%
Plat - 0%*
Other - 1.10%
(*Only because I haven't gotten any plats but its drop rate isn't complete 0%.)

Ultimate
1.70 AP per chest

Chest Rarity Rates
Plat - 0.16%
Gold - 15.49%
Silver - 18.47%
Bronze - 65.88%

Material Rates
Gold - 10.80%
Silver - 18.15%
Bronze - 40.69%
Iron - 25.51%
Enhance - 4.69%
Plat - 0.16%
Others - 0%

sanahtlig
06-03-2017, 11:38 PM
Is an extra 10% attack better than 20% HP?
HP up is useful on eidolons where it comes bundled with character attack, especially at low levels of assault skill.

TNinja
06-06-2017, 06:20 AM
Yea fair enough, i was just trying to offer some ideas. But if the agreed upon thing is that attack trumps all that's probably better. Just offering my experiences, limited as they may be.

I'm curious though as where people value HP. Is an extra 10% attack better than 20% HP? Or is the problem that the disasters are harder to farm, because in my experience when i'm trying to farm weapons from the raids they show up more than i care to see them. Or are the rare eidos just that easy to farm. Like i said i started back in Apocalypse so i have very limited experience with rares cause i used Diabolos cause the 10% attack and hp for all seemed good. Now i have all the event eidos and lots of weapons so i don't have much experience starting later with harder events.

I think people value attack more because the stronger the attack the faster they can drain the rage gauge aside Hp is not useful if doesn't get attacked, won't win you mvp, won't win you PP and the value only useful at the start of the game and not effective or useless for the rest of the game Except you're using potion.

sanahtlig
06-06-2017, 09:07 AM
I think people value attack more because the stronger the attack the faster they can drain the rage gauge aside Hp is not useful if doesn't get attacked, won't win you mvp, won't win you PP and the value only useful at the start of the game and not effective or useless for the rest of the game Except you're using potion.
If I had a Wind character ATK/HP eidolon, I'd be using it right now for Ultimate/Ragnarok, and so would many others.

fucka
06-06-2017, 02:13 PM
Can anyone give an estimate of an approximate Attack power that can reliably beat ultimate difficulty without needing an Elixer? (Assuming a neutral element team running Sol + Andromeda)

A Dark or light team for every case (ultimate).
30k+, you can try.
35k+, it should be manageable without effort.

other single element, 28k+ if advantage, 38k+ if disadvantage.