HELP US FIX THE GACHA RATE

[muckok]

Hey guys, we decided to do something about the shit rate ups on spotlight gachas, so we came up with this ticket. If you had enough of not getting your spotlight himes, just do the following steps to support our idea:
1) Go to Support section & choose Gameplay option
2) Select Kamihime Project R as Game
3) Select Other as Title to be able to specify an own title
4) Make the title "Rate up gacha"
5) Copy this text below:

We have seen the Darkness Selection Gacha campaign(Jul 15th ~ Jul 21st) with 6x rate up and we're deeply disappointed to see that the rate ups are still so low. Many players left with disappointment after drawing on any of the rate up gachas without obtaining the spotlight unit - be it with saved up jewels or spending hundreds of dollars on it.
DMM had their rate up increased to 15x for the first Halloween and increased to 20x the following Halloween. We should have had our rate up increased to 15x 9 months ago.
We demand that our rate up matches DMM's, and we demand compensation for the rolls that we did on the nerfed rate up gachas.

We're also sending nutaku_kamihime and regular Nutaku the same message on twitter, if you would take the time for that too

Mod Edit:

Read this out, take your conclusions.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/263690964399423489/468977021003759628/20180718_085146.jpg

2nd Mod Edit:

http://puu.sh/AZfpT/5e8bc0d73e.png

[Laventale]

Commenting in sticky thread.

[Unregistered]

I did... not expect that... (I'm the guy talking about rates in JP version in Q&A thread).

[idunno]

Higher rates would make the gacha significantly less disapointing

[nonsensei]

Let the revolution start!

[BlazeAlter]

higher rates = less crippling depression

seriously though, they should've done that a long time ago... I might've been able to resist spending any jewels at all and saved for somebody

[Slashley]

It's true, Nutaku Kamihime is extremely unfair since Jewels (and real life money) are both basically useless. You simply won't get what you want from the gacha, and it's only going to get worse.

[MagicSpice]

i've had a crap ton of luck on the gacha with pulling some SSR girls, but they're all off banner...

i think rate up is indeed a huge stretch that needs to be fixed cause sometimes it's difficult getting even the R and SR rate-up girls...

[Ginger D Arc]

I'm interested to see what becomes of this. As I'm one of the whales who has spent hundreds.

[Dargor]

And sent, now we wait to see if they give a fuck about this. Hopefully they will.

If iirc this is not the first time the community unites to change something in Kamihime. How did things ended last time?

[Laventale]

but they're all off banner...

The only time I pulled a hime from its banner was Daji, together with Metatron.

https://i.imgur.com/TJ0lY14.jpg

[nazrin992]

Got bot replies only...

[Laventale]

Got bot replies only...

I'm surprised you expected otherwise.

[Laventale]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/263690964399423489/468977021003759628/20180718_085146.jpg

Double post 'cuz why not.

[nazrin992]

>higher rates

Meanwhile with new gacha deal.

https://ibb.co/bREUPJ

10764

As you can see, above is the older version while the bottom is the newer version with no "6x" rates.

"Oh shit, players will be pissed at this 6x rates so let's delete that part and move on :)"

Brilliant.

[Kimoi]

Delayed content + skipped content + new bugs + lower gacha rates + 1 or 2 free SRs = original game.
Ok.

[Cobblemaniac]

Delayed content + skipped content + new bugs + lower gacha rates + 1 or 2 free SRs = original game.
Ok.

That profile picture is so appropriate for the comment too.

[Unregistered]

So the 3% is working as intended? Doesn't feel like it, I had 0 SSR outside purchase, 0 spotlight stuff ever, around 1 SSR out of 50 rolls, (exactly 2% rate), shouldn't even happened to me because their 3million player for sample size is nutaku being a massive lying sack of shit. Dropping this game for good, taking advantage that the games getting boring so my head is clear enough to think that they're cheating player out of their pocket and I'm offended.

[Slashley]

As far as we know, the 3% is correct. 1.5% SSR Hime and 1.5% SSR Eidolon. 50 rolls isn't much. It's extremely easy to miss an SSR with that.

[nazrin992]

Gacha rates NOT equals Gacha chances.

[Unregistered]

As far as we know, the 3% is correct. 1.5% SSR Hime and 1.5% SSR Eidolon. 50 rolls isn't much. It's extremely easy to miss an SSR with that.

sorry I may have worded it wrong, 1 in 50 on average is what happened, played for 7months, spent like 400€ and yeah I played other gacha game and even those with 1% rate are consistent in the long run so I’m dead sure this one is rigged. Either way, not giving a damn anymore, already found myself another cute fix. So, just think that I could be one of those few with shity luck or got rigged to induce cashing or whatever while you may be one of those super lucky f2p, good for you, have fun.

[MagicSpice]

like i said in another post, that 1.5% chance of an SSR hime is split between all the SSR in the pool...

so for instance, people trying to get Freyr have WAY LESS of a chance to get her (likely around 0.1%, even with rate boost).

so the chance of seeing a rainbow door is 1/33.333~ the chance of that door revealing an SSR is half that (so about 1/67), and that 1/67 is divided by the current SSR hime pool basically (assuming they all have an even chance cause that might not be true). and rate up only takes that specific chance and multiply it by 6....

even if we did have the x15 rate, that's still quite low, but even still, we're getting ripped off compared to DMM, cause assuming even hime rates and then tossing in multipliers that should be at this point, that's a 1/2680 chance when off banner, compared to 6/2680 or 15/2680 with the multipliers... if i got my math right...


and yet all nutaku is saying is "whoops, we'll think about it".... which i kinda expected but tried anyway

[nazrin992]

Keep talking and send tickets if the next maint and gacha banners doesn't included "Drop rates increase to 15x or above 15x(for starcha)".

I'm not going take such vague response for answer for something that we SHOULD have gotten.

[nonsensei]

"... Nutaku Kamihime is original like we made the exclusive character Demeter free in Nutaku Version and else."

Typical dodging the issue on hand answer. Just throw in a counter example & use the magical words "and others" or "and else" to create an illusion that there are various examples.

[Yolodesu]

Typical dodging the issue on hand answer. Just throw in a counter example & use the magical words "and others" or "and else" to create an illusion that there are various examples.

You're rude dude there are plenty of examples.
Remember that time when they gave us free inventory space?
And that time when they gave us unique burst effect on Ares and Sol?
Wait...

Seriously that's a regular issue with Asians games being handled by occidental publisher (both US and EU) : they are greedy bastards. As a matter of fact, that's a common thing with occidental F2P in general.
While i was playing mmo, the one that disgusted me the most was swtor. Wanna have acces to multiple action bar to put all your skills? pay for it. Wanna hide your ugly helmet? pay for it. Wanna run? pay for it. Wanna buy something in game? yeah sure but first pay to remove the 300k credits limitation.

Dunno why it's like that, probably Asians gamers tend to pay more than us. But honestly when you see that, it doesn't make you wan't to support the game.

[Kimoi]

You're rude dude there are plenty of examples.
He isn't dude, he's nonsensei... wait, I'm not using the appropriate username here.

Anyway, what did we get differently from the DMM version so far?
+ Demeter as a login bonus (originally a visual novel bonus)
+ Pharol as a Dragon Providence crossover reward (originally an artbook bonus)
+ Duplicated reprints of Medusa/Rahab and Ixion/Yata (which had the side effect of enabling use of non-friend eidolons much earlier than expected)
+ SSR awakenings being released one week early (I believe Ares's was two, even)
+ Sol AW's $$ deal being the post-2nd anniversary guaranteed spotlight, instead of the usual scamcha
+ Slightly expanded Miracle Ticket roster
+ A few select himes introduced with their first balance patch already implemented (ex: Eros, Daphne)
o Misplaced Garuda/Typhon reprint, right after another advent (Yata's first run)
o Koihime collab as a 2-week event, being the only event for a week and a sub event later (was a month-long sub event on DMM)
o Dragon Providence crossovers (but I'm fairly sure DMM Kamihime got crossovers of its own)
o Different reset time(s)
- New original bugs every other maintenance
- No Walkure Romanze collab
- Delayed non-event content (Hercules, Thunder & Fire Catastrophes, etc.)
- Lower spotlight rates
- No free inventory space during 1st anniversary
- Worse performance? (Could be due to lack of futurely implemented improvements, but watching any playthrough movies of the DMM version -- even when played by fellow gaijin -- lets us see a much smoother playing experience)

Is that it? You can frame that list as having more pluses than minuses, but the former tend to be small adjustments, while the latter are broader issues...


Dunno why it's like that, probably Asians gamers tend to pay more than us. But honestly when you see that, it doesn't make you wan't to support the game.
Japanese and Koreans seem to be fair more open to the idea of paying their way to victory in an online game, yeah. It seems DMM's Kamihime has a much larger player base (judging by rankings), they're more willing to spend, and probably burn far more money than we do -- someone posted a screenshot of a whale who had over 1,400 dragon eyes on Discord, I wish I had saved it.

[Slashley]

Anyway, what did we get differently from the DMM version so far?
+ Demeter as a login bonus (originally a visual novel bonus)
+ Pharol as a Dragon Providence crossover reward (originally an artbook bonus)
+ Duplicated reprints of Medusa/Rahab and Ixion/Yata (which had the side effect of enabling use of non-friend eidolons much earlier than expected)
+ SSR awakenings being released one week early (I believe Ares's was two, even)
+ Sol AW's $$ deal being the post-2nd anniversary guaranteed spotlight, instead of the usual scamcha
+ Slightly expanded Miracle Ticket roster
+ A few select himes introduced with their first balance patch already implemented (ex: Eros, Daphne)
o Misplaced Garuda/Typhon reprint, right after another advent (Yata's first run)
o Koihime collab as a 2-week event, being the only event for a week and a sub event later (was a month-long sub event on DMM)
o Dragon Providence crossovers (but I'm fairly sure DMM Kamihime got crossovers of its own)
o Different reset time(s)
- New original bugs every other maintenance
- No Walkure Romanze collab
- Delayed non-event content (Hercules, Thunder & Fire Catastrophes, etc.)
- Lower spotlight rates
- No free inventory space during 1st anniversary
- Worse performance? (Could be due to lack of futurely implemented improvements, but watching any playthrough movies of the DMM version -- even when played by fellow gaijin -- lets us see a much smoother playing experience)That's... actually a pretty good list. There are some small, insignificant nitpicks about it, but I can't think of anything major missing from there.

[Kimoi]

That's... actually a pretty good list. There are some small, insignificant nitpicks about it, but I can't think of anything major missing from there.
Part of me wants to find an excuse to send them a list like that, just to show we've been paying attention.

[Slashley]

Then, I'll nitpick some details. As I said, you covered all the important ones.

+ We got the "unable to see raid help requests until you've visited the top of the raid event screen" in April 2018, when DMM got it in Feb 2018 (so we got it eight months earlier). Obviously, Nutaku did this just to reduce the support ticket overload of "OMG WHERE ARE MY RAID REWARDS?!?" that happened at each raid event, but hey, we still got it early.
+ non-KH SSR weapons removed from gacha in early Dec rather than late Jan
o Atk debuff cap implemented slightly earlier
- Nutaku original bug: Sol's Awakening Burst effect was missing for weeks.
- Nutaku original bug: After we got Sol's Awakening Burst, Sol counted as two Hime in Bursts, so a Full Burst would include 6 characters and forever crash the fight for you (instant Nike trying to rejoin). This was fixed fairly fast, however (less than a week?)
- Accessory Quests two weeks late
- Kaiser Dragoon buff two weeks late
- Hercules late late august -> late dec
- Ult Wind mid Feb -> early March
- Ult Thunder early Jan -> late April (NO ARTHUR WEAPONS?)
- Nutaku original bug: Dartagnan HP weapon fixed late April (was broken for over a month)
- Ult dailies late April -> late May
- Ult fire early May -> early July (this one was particularly jarring due to Ult water already being out before this (which was on schedule!), and that fight has Triggers, whileas the OLDER Ult fire does not!)

And then there's a couple of things I don't know for sure:
UI redesign earlier? Is the UI redesign we just got the same one that came with GO on DMM?
SFW client reclothing earlier came out earlier here, I think?

[MagicSpice]

Part of me wants to find an excuse to send them a list like that, just to show we've been paying attention.

if that's the case, copypaste that list and send another ticket about it...

[Laventale]

- Nutaku original bug: Dartagnan HP weapon fixed late April (was broken for over a month)

To think that I was the first to discover that bug because I was the only one to buy D'art's Wind HP weapon, then I spoke with Bear about it...

I mean, eventually the bug would've been evident, but it's better rather sooner than later tbh.

[Laventale]

http://puu.sh/AZfpT/5e8bc0d73e.png

Double posting is fun.

[MagicSpice]

http://puu.sh/AZfpT/5e8bc0d73e.png



https://i.giphy.com/media/XMc1Ui9rAFR1m/source.gif


GG Nutaku CS.... GG...

[King-Electronics]

[perapera;] It seems DMM's Kamihime has a much larger player base (judging by rankings), they're more willing to spend, and probably burn far more money than we do -- someone posted a screenshot of a whale who had over 1,400 dragon eyes on Discord, I wish I had saved it.


I tried checking, killed one expert demon, just one, and it stands at 9000th place so, 10000 active accounts is the limit I guess, if 5000 pp can be considered active. Sigh, this game is dying.

Thinking further: out of those 9000 accounts, assuming most player have 1 alt, then a lot of player have 2, then plenty have three, then some have an entire union just for themselves... I say 2000k actual player is closer to reality than their recent claim of 3million player.. that one's reaching for the sky and then beyond into yo momma's ass.

[Slashley]

Obviously, 3m "players" means "accounts." Almost all of which are reroll accounts. Nutaku knows this (I hope). It's just PR.

I don't know if 2000 active players is "dying" though. Sure it doesn't hold against some games like Fortnite, but seems like a good amount of income nonetheless.

[King-Electronics]

Obviously, 3m "players" means "accounts." Almost all of which are reroll accounts. Nutaku knows this (I hope). It's just PR.

I don't know if 2000 active players is "dying" though. Sure it doesn't hold against some games like Fortnite, but seems like a good amount of income nonetheless.

Just being sarcastic and I'm not a pleasant guy. Anyway, forgot the number but quick google says percentage of f2p that ends up spending cash are between 0.19% to 2.2%, lets round it up up to eleven, yeah 11% of 2000 is 220 persons, and lets be generously-generous-as-a-generous-god when assuming each of them spend $100 monthly, thats $22k monthly revenue, their other game titstitan of fapmonkey or whatever will probably have revenue akin to winrar.

Aand to avoid derailing from the topic I will say: gacha rate sucks, my advice for them is at least try to provide entertainment instead of being a wannabe underworld gambling den. They nerfed the overall gacha, by now its too obvious to ignore, just search youtube for peoples rolls in nutaku's kamihime, afterwards ask yourself, does that look like 3% to you? like 4 out of 5 vids are having a lot less SSR than what they're suppose to be getting. Like people only able to liquidate 60% of estimated gain, like the rates is actually in reality is 2%!!

[Slashley]

Just being sarcastic and I'm not a pleasant guy. Anyway, forgot the number but quick google says percentage of f2p that ends up spending cash are between 0.19% to 2.2%, lets round it up up to eleven, yeah 11% of 2000 is 220 persons, and lets be generously-generous-as-a-generous-god when assuming each of them spend $100 monthly, thats $22k monthly revenue, their other game titstitan of fapmonkey or whatever will probably have revenue akin to winrar. --You forget that none of these people you mention don't have any worth whatsoever. Dolphins are not the reason why F2P exists - whales are.

A single whale can easily pay ten times that much. Every. Single. Month.

That's the only reason why F2P exists, to find a whale and get more money from that guy - or maybe even his whale friends! - than what you could ever make by making an actual game.

[King-Electronics]

You forget that none of these people you mention don't have any worth whatsoever. Dolphins are not the reason why F2P exists - whales are.

A single whale can easily pay ten times that much. Every. Single. Month.

That's the only reason why F2P exists, to find a whale and get more money from that guy - or maybe even his whale friends! - than what you could ever make by making an actual game.

Exactly what I said, worthless revenue of $20k monthly. And talking about whale is like talking religion, where are they, a single person spending $200k per month, who is it, should've been super famous right, such as one with all MLBed 100% eidolon, never seen one; best one I've seen is MLBed on only one of them, even thats using brick. All I see is at most are spoiled kids spending thousands monthly, thats not a whale, I had splurged like that when I was in my worst phase of gambling addiction (not in this game fortunately and not anymore). To make it simple, proof or it doesn't exist.
OR.. I just remembered what a pal told me along time ago, that those magical arab prince whaling (even in hentai games, yes!) are something made up as a cover to some kind of shady financial activity. So maybe thats good, meaning nutaku will still going strong, I don't care if they cook book for some romanian mob or something as long as I got my hentai.

[Slashley]

We used to have one... but Maru quit :think:
We have quite a few serious whales, but nothing on that level are left as far as I know.

[QXZ]

ya i smelled rat too... i blew away 54k jewels and didnt get the banner himes. the rate ups are just too low.

[Unregistered]

There's no such thing as whale funding the majority, its a big fat lie to make dolphin felt insignificant so they're less likely to make a fuss if anything went wrong (they're especially scared of a mass refund, it can literally kill the company)
Ever since the era of crowdfunding, every project out there that has tiered investment/donation system has proven again and again that 99% of the money comes from dolphins.

[Slashley]

Crowdfunding is something that you give money to once, and then forget about it. <br />
<br />
Games work differently. You keep playing, and give money however often you want - and in today's lootbox(/gacha)...

[King-Electronics]

You're fantasizing, if the maximum nekopara had earned was 936k, how likely is a single person that got backer's package of 10k would spend 10million! what I'm BETTING is that one 10k backer guy is...

[Unregistered]

You're fantasizing, if the maximum nekopara had earned was 936k, how likely is a single person that got backer's package of 10k would spend 10million! what I'm BETTING is that one 10k backer guy is an insider backing themself just to "look good" or simply baiting, which is a way too common tactic and a million times more likely.

And by the way, is this maru guy even a real player? For a telltale if he's genuine, did he ever buy gold for his union or friends? all those pseudo-whale out there done that, if not, how sure are you he's an actual player and not an insider "pretending just to look good", a bait (for dolphins of course, they'd have to sell their grandma for an actual whale), a kid emptying his parents bank account, or worse, a sucidal guy burning everything left before offing themself, the kind you find in most casino.

you jerk, saying maru is dead is kinda rude mang. Becaus it can actually happen! Jesus I can't get this off my head now.

[Slashley]

You're fantasizing, if the maximum nekopara had earned was 936k, how likely is a single person that got backer's package of 10k would spend 10million! what I'm BETTING is that one 10k backer guy is an insider backing themself just to "look good" or simply baiting, which is a way too common tactic and a million times more likely.The very same guy bought a Steam trading card from me at 50 euros.

And my god, did I feel like an idiot after that. He would've paid thousands just for the sake of being the first one to get his hands on a virtual badge on his virtual Steam account. And I sold one of the pieces to him for just fifty euros...

Sigh. I doubt I'll ever again be the first person to get a Foil card of anything ever again, but if I do, lesson learned: start high. For people who have more money than common sense, the price is just a number.

[Cobblemaniac]

You're fantasizing, if the maximum nekopara had earned was 936k, how likely is a single person that got backer's package of 10k would spend 10million! what I'm BETTING is that one 10k backer guy is an insider backing themself just to "look good" or simply baiting, which is a way too common tactic and a million times more likely.

And by the way, is this maru guy even a real player? For a telltale if he's genuine, did he ever buy gold for his union or friends? all those pseudo-whale out there done that, if not, how sure are you he's an actual player and not an insider "pretending just to look good", a bait (for dolphins of course, they'd have to sell their grandma for an actual whale), a kid emptying his parents bank account, or worse, a sucidal guy burning everything left before offing themself, the kind you find in most casino.

Let's ignore whatever numbers there are... ever heard of exaggeration to make the point? Personally I'm not sure of the numbers, and I won't say it's true or not. But... you get the point he's making. Right? Regardless of what you feel?

Or look at this way. The point is made if the number is exaggerated. What if it isn't? Even better, there's actual people willing to go this far, therefore cementing said point.


The very same guy bought a Steam trading card from me at 50 euros.

And my god, did I feel like an idiot after that. He would've paid thousands just for the sake of being the first one to get his hands on a virtual badge on his virtual Steam account. And I sold one of the pieces to him for just fifty euros...

Sigh. I doubt I'll ever again be the first person to get a Foil card of anything ever again, but if I do, lesson learned: start high. For people who have more money than common sense, the price is just a number.

I thought 50 euros was pretty darn high already tbh, but oh wells, concept of money for the rich.

[King_Electronics]

I get the points so I said its no longer an exaggeration but a fantasy. Do you get mine?
See, like talking religion, cementing points with a what if, that's probatio diabolica. And now concept of money for the rich is 50$? that's inconsistent standard.

I don't care anymore, the point is, do you want that 15x rate up or not? Or you rather have even less because hypothetically that could be a good strategy for baiting "whales" to spend even more, therefore keeping the game alive for the rest of us tunas.

[Slashley]

I don't think you've understood how wealth distribution works in reality. Glancing through this (https://www.theguardian.com/inequality/2017/nov/14/worlds-richest-wealth-credit-suisse), I find:
Dollar millionaires make up 0.7% of the adult population but hold 46% of global wealth

You see, game makers have realized "Wait, why should we limit ourselves to only half the amount of money available? Let's make a system where one person can pay more than everyone else combined!"

If dolphins were the main interest, don't you think the game would be far better off selling... I dunno, Hime directly? 50 bucks per specific SSR Hime, buy as many as you want (instead of one per 4 months)! 10 bucks per specific SR. Can't afford it? Jewel random gacha is still there!

The amount of dolphins would skyrocket, don't you think? But, that'd mean capping the amount of money that Nutaku/DMM could make from whales. To a mere... uh, I dunno how much it is, 50*50 + 50*10 bucks or something like that. I can't be bothered to count the current count. Anyway, despite getting hundreds of new dolphins (maybe even thousands out of the ~8k Nutaku playerbase), it just isn't worth it to lose the whales.
--
I don't care anymore, the point is, do you want that 15x rate up or not? --Of course we want that. That's basically a requirement to keep the game going. Even whales value their time to SOME extent, and the amount of pulls that they need to do keeps increasing more and more with the release of every SSR Hime.

But this is this and that is that. Just because this is a thread about the 15x Rate Up, doesn't mean that we can't talk about other things.

[IC-F]

Interesting, this topic really, I'm an f2p in kamihime but I once whaled in exvius, brave frontier, and potk. We also had similar discussion about how much does our whale actually spend on gacha. The most we found in our group spent a total of 50k$ before said person quit (BF), we know he's wealthy but his parents barred him from credit card when he got found out. I myself spent 2500$ on each game, but seeing the discussion here makes me pretty much a dophin lol.

I have question, does nutaku bought full license or partial license from dmm? the later doesn't include back-end access meaning they can't do anything about the rate, and the licensor tend to lower the rate when the revenue goes down (happened to potk). so which one is it?

[Slashley]

As far as I know, that information is not public.

I think DMM has supposedly pulled other games from Nutaku, if that helps? Assuming that Nutaku has spoken true and not, you know, lied to us about it being DMM decision.

[Tanaka5]

Welp. After the first 2 responses, I sent a third ticket and now no response. I'm assuming if it's a delayed one, it's just going to be the same again. The only thing we can do is keep spamming those tickets. Even if they will most likely just give bot responses (I hope it's not the old "We cannot disclose gacha rates")

Just hoping we do get better rates at some point because pulling so many jewels or occasionally spending star coins for a specific unit of choice and getting other SSRs and everything but the spotlight unit is really frustrating for all kinds of players alike.

Guess I won't be spending for SSArty or Water Osiris then. Sticking to Guaranteeds

[IC-F]

As far as I know, that information is not public.

I think DMM has supposedly pulled other games from Nutaku, if that helps? Assuming that Nutaku has spoken true and not, you know, lied to us about it being DMM decision.

I see, sounded like DMM is the one pulling the strings. It helps that I prolly won't spend a dime for this game lol, I had enough of having a game killed, twice, oh the pain of losing every ultra rare gacha item overnight.

[x255]

Its easy to see that these "nutaku" games mostly use dmm servers still... You can bet its not a full license.

[Laventale]

Its easy to see that these "nutaku" games mostly use dmm servers still... You can bet its not a full license.

Well, obviously not, otherwise it would cost a lot of money to buy the full rights of the game.

[FreeToPay]

When they pulled Aigis from Nutaku, it was clear as hell that they don't run any of the DMM ports. RIP Aigis and any chances that we get half of the stuff that DMM players get.