Thread: The Problem with Harem Hero Events - And A Potential Solution

Originally Posted by Shad0w

I'm not a fan of the concept of event boosters. Every event, most players are only interested in one or two girls. Allowing them to obtain them for free removes any incentive to spend real money on the game. What you're currently suggesting would allow players to obtain two event girls for each event. The event idol isn't the popular girl anyways and it's usually the troll drops/Epic Pachinko drops that players would want in the first place.On top of that, your suggestion would essentially allow anyone to obtain past girls if they wait long enough without having to spend a significant amount of money. This would reduce Epic Pachinko drops to costing 600 kobans instead of 900 kobans AND allow users to select who they want, which is ludicrous.

The current system rewards players for spending kobans and obtaining past girls in the first place and your suggestion would essentially punish older players for having spent money, while rewarding free players and essentially encouraging all players not to spend money/spend very little money on the game.

The team would basically have very little overall income if players were to obtain the 2 girls they cared about for the event in the first place for free. The game would not be self-sustainable and continue to take a loss. Please keep in mind that the game developers are working on the game full-time.

My personal preference would be to bring back each event's specific girls in the form that the original appeared while introducing a new wave girls. This would give older players something to go for while giving new players access to the event's past girls+ new girls. There would be two event every year, once during the anniversary and once during the New Year, where players would be able to obtain past event girls through a special Pachinko for kobans at the standard costs.

This would continue to keep the game self-sustainable while keeping everyone happy.

Could you provide any proof that no one wants the event idol and only two girls? Or are you projecting your interests onto the entire player base?

They already did an "anniversary" event making every girl come back from every event they did so far, including limited girls into Epic pachinko.

So that basicly "Lost ever" is already a lie. And let's make the real call outs. You are missing girls and want more, yet you're either a new player, a veteran that has been unlucky. Or either just a cry baby. You have either a entirely different mind set that you're obviously posting here. So stop being selfish and look at the real facts

Originally Posted by Greetingz

They already did an "anniversary" event making every girl come back from every event they did so far, including limited girls into Epic pachinko.

So that basicly "Lost ever" is already a lie. And let's make the real call outs. You are missing girls and want more, yet you're either a new player, a veteran that has been unlucky. Or either just a cry baby. You have either a entirely different mind set that you're obviously posting here. So stop being selfish and look at the real facts

God forbid I have criticisms of a game. But if you want me to fuck off, I will - Because while I'd love to counter and respond to your claims here, I'd rather just be told I'm not welcome here.

First off, I like how you think out of the box and try to make it possible for new players to get the older event girls (though you forget the Halloween event, even though that event was in a different format :P)

Personally I don't like the idea of the black market and the tickets. Right now it punishes old paying players for having paid for the girls.
And to be honest, you don't want to make paying players feel that they are punished.

However, I wasn't a big fan of the anniversary event. I think everybody has a couple of favourite event girls out there, that they couldn't get, yet it was highly unlikely to get the girl(s) you actually wanted with all of them in there.

I like the event booster tickets though. During an anniversary like event, I'd like it if I could get some kind of booster for a certain event so that when I spin the pachinko, I have a bigger chance on the girls from that event (still RNG, but at least you increase the odds).

Please don't feed the trolls

Given building the Harem is 'the game' and there is no end game content being able to channel energy into any kind of farming would be nice too.

And the idea of perma locked content doesn't sit well with me either, yes the dev can open the vault whenever they like but a more structured way would be appreciated - I'd rather not have everything koban locked - and hopefully part of the rethink will vist the cost/koban ratio

Perhaps after a time, or once a world is farmed out the bosses could drop tokens, and these tokens in time could be traded for old event girls....so say you wanted event girl X, boss Y drops the tokens, you need to farm all 3 girls then say 3 tokens....as rare as a girl drop...to get 1 girl

LOT of work, but end game....

They could just do re-issue events and/or perma re-issue events like FKG does. Those don't hurt old players, nor they hurt whales. They actually help all players including whales to get content they missed, and having just re-issues on the side of main events doesn't hurt whales who got everything before. As long as you don't think letting new people get old content hurts old players cause the had stuff you don't just cause they got into game faster.

Hek - it could actually bring more revenue for devs. We have so much events, that F2P cant really spin 900 kobans pachinko for girl each event, add the fact that there is more than 1 girl and that you need luck to get event girls (if you didn't farm all troll normal girls before-hand), and you end up with situation where its actually harder for F2P people to get premium content girls, which could force more of them to go whales and buy kobans to spin more times. Just having re-issue events side-to-side with normal events could force some "stamina" refilling for having more chances to get event girls from trolls (for new people mostly).

Thats just my idea of solving this "old content not available anymore" problem. Thou personally I find HH premium content to be to damn expensive for me to even care about it, but it would let me get F2P stuff I possibly missed.

We're ALL "free" players in this. There's no subscription service. It's entirely voluntary if and when we choose to support the devs a bit with a purchase. An argument could be made though that more people might feel like paying and/or people might feel like paying more often if the prices were lower...

Regardless, those who would prefer not to pay do know that there's a selection of content that they just won't be getting. (At least not often. There are some free kobans that we can chase after and slowly save up.) The devs will handle that portion of the game in whatever way they feel makes the most business sense for them, we'll grumble about it a bit because it doesn't look too good from our end, but ultimately many of us will mostly ignore that portion of the game since it would be too absurd to be a completionist about it.

Ideas are thrown around, offered up for the devs' consideration, trying to smooth over the RNG of the standard portion of the game. The part that doesn't require kobans, just time. Random is random, of course. If the odds of something are 1 out of 100, in theory it should take around 100 rolls to get it but you'll have some players getting it at roll number 97 or 103 or 85 or 125 or 21 or 842 or whatever. The majority should fall closer to 100, but there will be outliers.

Anyway, I don't know what the chances are for girls to drop. I think I saw a post saying around 1 in 300? But sometimes you get on the low end of the curve and amazing luck delivers to you one or perhaps even both event drops (plus maybe even a non-event drop) all within the first day or two of the event, and sometimes you get on the high end of the curve and abysmal luck sees you trying dozens upon dozens of times every single day through the entire run of the event without any drops at all. And it is extremely frustrating when you're on that high end of the curve.

It is for those rougher streaks of bad luck that people propose ideas like "pity counters" to alter the chances after multiple failed attempts or "event token" drops to collect with better drop chances than the instant-win drop but needing to save up a bunch of them before you can use those to purchase that drop. Ideally the balance on such an idea would be that it will not take much longer to get the drop from this "shortcut" than it ought to take for an average case of lucking out on the instant-win drop right around the expected number of attempts. (Perhaps even aiming for a balance where you could realistically only expect to earn enough tokens for one of the two that you're trying to get from the bosses, still relying on luck to instant-win the other one.) A case of better luck on getting the girl to drop will see that result before the alternative can be used. The alternative would exist for the case where someone just isn't having that kind of luck.

Now this topic's original post does try suggest a way to revamp all aspects of the game into a more unified bigger picture, meaning that it is tinkering with both the "premium" and the "standard".... I think? Wait, no, he specifically said that some girls would continue to be pachinko exclusive (but they'd always be possible drops and they'd just be much more likely to drop from the pachinko during their event than they are outside of it) and the "black market" selection would be limited to the event girls who are NOT designated as pachinko exclusives. So the divide between "premium" content and "standard" content is still there.

Anyway, since the idea suggested a token reward/drop which would also be possible to pay kobans for, the balance of all the costs and drop rates of such a plan would be subject to heavy scrutiny by the devs if they consider it. They might have their own ideas about how much things should cost and how hard it should be to save up the tokens to buy something, as well as whether or not they'd agree with the topic creator's idea to draw a line where event variations of existing girls would be pachinko exclusive and only the brand new girls would appear in the black market (maybe the devs would want it the other way around as thanks for those who do buy kobans).

I'm pretty sure the topic creator gets that his values are examples and up for debate, that they're not an absolute final word on what should be used.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

We're ALL "free" players in this. There's no subscription service. It's entirely voluntary if and when we choose to support the devs a bit with a purchase. An argument could be made though that more people might feel like paying and/or people might feel like paying more often if the prices were lower...

Regardless, those who would prefer not to pay do know that there's a selection of content that they just won't be getting. (At least not often. There are some free kobans that we can chase after and slowly save up.) The devs will handle that portion of the game in whatever way they feel makes the most business sense for them, we'll grumble about it a bit because it doesn't look too good from our end, but ultimately many of us will mostly ignore that portion of the game since it would be too absurd to be a completionist about it.

Ideas are thrown around, offered up for the devs' consideration, trying to smooth over the RNG of the standard portion of the game. The part that doesn't require kobans, just time. Random is random, of course. If the odds of something are 1 out of 100, in theory it should take around 100 rolls to get it but you'll have some players getting it at roll number 97 or 103 or 85 or 125 or 21 or 842 or whatever. The majority should fall closer to 100, but there will be outliers.

Anyway, I don't know what the chances are for girls to drop. I think I saw a post saying around 1 in 300? But sometimes you get on the low end of the curve and amazing luck delivers to you one or perhaps even both event drops (plus maybe even a non-event drop) all within the first day or two of the event, and sometimes you get on the high end of the curve and abysmal luck sees you trying dozens upon dozens of times every single day through the entire run of the event without any drops at all. And it is extremely frustrating when you're on that high end of the curve.

It is for those rougher streaks of bad luck that people propose ideas like "pity counters" to alter the chances after multiple failed attempts or "event token" drops to collect with better drop chances than the instant-win drop but needing to save up a bunch of them before you can use those to purchase that drop. Ideally the balance on such an idea would be that it will not take much longer to get the drop from this "shortcut" than it ought to take for an average case of lucking out on the instant-win drop right around the expected number of attempts. (Perhaps even aiming for a balance where you could realistically only expect to earn enough tokens for one of the two that you're trying to get from the bosses, still relying on luck to instant-win the other one.) A case of better luck on getting the girl to drop will see that result before the alternative can be used. The alternative would exist for the case where someone just isn't having that kind of luck.

Now this topic's original post does try suggest a way to revamp all aspects of the game into a more unified bigger picture, meaning that it is tinkering with both the "premium" and the "standard".... I think? Wait, no, he specifically said that some girls would continue to be pachinko exclusive (but they'd always be possible drops and they'd just be much more likely to drop from the pachinko during their event than they are outside of it) and the "black market" selection would be limited to the event girls who are NOT designated as pachinko exclusives. So the divide between "premium" content and "standard" content is still there.

Anyway, since the idea suggested a token reward/drop which would also be possible to pay kobans for, the balance of all the costs and drop rates of such a plan would be subject to heavy scrutiny by the devs if they consider it. They might have their own ideas about how much things should cost and how hard it should be to save up the tokens to buy something, as well as whether or not they'd agree with the topic creator's idea to draw a line where event variations of existing girls would be pachinko exclusive and only the brand new girls would appear in the black market (maybe the devs would want it the other way around as thanks for those who do buy kobans).

I'm pretty sure the topic creator gets that his values are examples and up for debate, that they're not an absolute final word on what should be used.

For the most part, I concur with what was stated here.

After grasping the basic understanding of the OP's suggestion through his example, I find myself in disagreement with his solution. However, I do not feel that he is 1) a cry-baby, and 2) selfish. I don't want to start anything, but I only see Greetingz' statement on the matter as being fairly openly antagonistic against a user who IS sharing constructive criticism. Both share a mutual passion, as do we all. Where else would this thread come from if not out of passion and a yearning to see the game do well? Let's not create a divide between one another with callus remarks, but rather appreciate and encourage cordial debate. (This is one of the few reasons many, including myself, have left and no longer participate in the Harem Heroes Discord.)

There is certainly a difference between, as you said, "premium" and "standard" content with the OP's suggestion. A user will still need to purchase kobans to try their luck with the exclusive epic pachinko haremettes while also needing to play the game to obtain the event exclusive girls. His approach aligns with the already existing format, albeit differently.

I look forward to the recently announced changes and seeing what approach Kinkoid will take in regards to this matter - if any at all. I for one would prefer to see a redesign in terms of level balance and drop rates. The rumored inclusion of guilds also intrigues me from a community point of view. Perhaps the inclusion of an in-game chat as well?

Originally Posted by NinjaW

Could you provide any proof that no one wants the event idol and only two girls? Or are you projecting your interests onto the entire player base?

The event idol isn't the popular girl anyways and it's usually the troll drops/Epic Pachinko drops that players would want in the first place. L2R

People are NOT happy with the current format though. I'm sure that many would rather just ignore pachinko-only girls instead of shelling out the prices currently being asked for. And while we understand that RNG is a harsh mistress and sometimes the luck just isn't with you, it still stings when you get a bad streak.

"Some" free players aren't happy with the current format. If you're playing enough, you will almost certainly get the event girls. It takes work to get some things in life.

I don't know about that. I consider them to be the saving grace of the event format. The very first event didn't have that yet and it was only the troll drops and the pachinko drops. It was kind of nice in the events after that where you know that you've got at least one girl guaranteed no matter what happens with the RNG.

Isn't the popular girl =/= no guaranteed event girl

DrQuatsch - I suggested to Jessie a booster that could be purchased for Kobans that would increase the drop rate of event girls by a bit for the duration of the event. Your idea works too!

The F2P posts here remind me of other F2P posts in games. There's always the crowd of free players that "suggest" ideas that would essentially give them whatever they want (the premium content), without having to spend money. It's a thinly veiled suggestion. Just be upfront about it and say, hey, I don't want to spend much money, but I want all the awesome premium content that everyone else has to pay for.

OP basically deflected on the key points that I mentioned.

God forbid I have criticisms of a game.

I think Greetingz wants you to offer constructive criticism of the game, not basically you saying that you want to have a way to obtain premium content without having to spend the money.