Thread: The Problem with Harem Hero Events - And A Potential Solution

Originally Posted by Unregistered

We're ALL "free" players in this. There's no subscription service. It's entirely voluntary if and when we choose to support the devs a bit with a purchase. An argument could be made though that more people might feel like paying and/or people might feel like paying more often if the prices were lower...

Regardless, those who would prefer not to pay do know that there's a selection of content that they just won't be getting. (At least not often. There are some free kobans that we can chase after and slowly save up.) The devs will handle that portion of the game in whatever way they feel makes the most business sense for them, we'll grumble about it a bit because it doesn't look too good from our end, but ultimately many of us will mostly ignore that portion of the game since it would be too absurd to be a completionist about it.

Ideas are thrown around, offered up for the devs' consideration, trying to smooth over the RNG of the standard portion of the game. The part that doesn't require kobans, just time. Random is random, of course. If the odds of something are 1 out of 100, in theory it should take around 100 rolls to get it but you'll have some players getting it at roll number 97 or 103 or 85 or 125 or 21 or 842 or whatever. The majority should fall closer to 100, but there will be outliers.

Anyway, I don't know what the chances are for girls to drop. I think I saw a post saying around 1 in 300? But sometimes you get on the low end of the curve and amazing luck delivers to you one or perhaps even both event drops (plus maybe even a non-event drop) all within the first day or two of the event, and sometimes you get on the high end of the curve and abysmal luck sees you trying dozens upon dozens of times every single day through the entire run of the event without any drops at all. And it is extremely frustrating when you're on that high end of the curve.

It is for those rougher streaks of bad luck that people propose ideas like "pity counters" to alter the chances after multiple failed attempts or "event token" drops to collect with better drop chances than the instant-win drop but needing to save up a bunch of them before you can use those to purchase that drop. Ideally the balance on such an idea would be that it will not take much longer to get the drop from this "shortcut" than it ought to take for an average case of lucking out on the instant-win drop right around the expected number of attempts. (Perhaps even aiming for a balance where you could realistically only expect to earn enough tokens for one of the two that you're trying to get from the bosses, still relying on luck to instant-win the other one.) A case of better luck on getting the girl to drop will see that result before the alternative can be used. The alternative would exist for the case where someone just isn't having that kind of luck.

Now this topic's original post does try suggest a way to revamp all aspects of the game into a more unified bigger picture, meaning that it is tinkering with both the "premium" and the "standard".... I think? Wait, no, he specifically said that some girls would continue to be pachinko exclusive (but they'd always be possible drops and they'd just be much more likely to drop from the pachinko during their event than they are outside of it) and the "black market" selection would be limited to the event girls who are NOT designated as pachinko exclusives. So the divide between "premium" content and "standard" content is still there.

Anyway, since the idea suggested a token reward/drop which would also be possible to pay kobans for, the balance of all the costs and drop rates of such a plan would be subject to heavy scrutiny by the devs if they consider it. They might have their own ideas about how much things should cost and how hard it should be to save up the tokens to buy something, as well as whether or not they'd agree with the topic creator's idea to draw a line where event variations of existing girls would be pachinko exclusive and only the brand new girls would appear in the black market (maybe the devs would want it the other way around as thanks for those who do buy kobans).

I'm pretty sure the topic creator gets that his values are examples and up for debate, that they're not an absolute final word on what should be used.

For the most part, I concur with what was stated here.

After grasping the basic understanding of the OP's suggestion through his example, I find myself in disagreement with his solution. However, I do not feel that he is 1) a cry-baby, and 2) selfish. I don't want to start anything, but I only see Greetingz' statement on the matter as being fairly openly antagonistic against a user who IS sharing constructive criticism. Both share a mutual passion, as do we all. Where else would this thread come from if not out of passion and a yearning to see the game do well? Let's not create a divide between one another with callus remarks, but rather appreciate and encourage cordial debate. (This is one of the few reasons many, including myself, have left and no longer participate in the Harem Heroes Discord.)

There is certainly a difference between, as you said, "premium" and "standard" content with the OP's suggestion. A user will still need to purchase kobans to try their luck with the exclusive epic pachinko haremettes while also needing to play the game to obtain the event exclusive girls. His approach aligns with the already existing format, albeit differently.

I look forward to the recently announced changes and seeing what approach Kinkoid will take in regards to this matter - if any at all. I for one would prefer to see a redesign in terms of level balance and drop rates. The rumored inclusion of guilds also intrigues me from a community point of view. Perhaps the inclusion of an in-game chat as well?

This is my two cents. I think it should be more reasonable the price. If they asked maybe 1-5 or 5-10 bucks for an epic girl than in the long term, they will make more money than in the short term. If the prices are too high, you are losing potential customers. It's not that people have to pay that bother them. I myself pay the Patron each month. It's the insane amount.

It's true a bunch of content is locked away that most of the community will never see. It's just hard to justify 1000 Korbans for 10 spins. Most of the gear, I can't use. Then I view the new singles scene once. (There really should be a feature to save the image when you unlock girls so you can go back to look at their scenes) Once I got 1200 Korbans. I spent it on epic spin 10x I didn't feel like I got my money worth. Those Korbans were given to me via promotion 300 each for however long you are active. If I spent actual money on it. I'd be unhappy with the return.

I know people have to make money. I get that it's not cheap. My suggestion is this. You are missing out on let's say 500 customers who might never buy due to high price. What happens if we lower price to even 5 bucks for 10x spins.Those people also potentially possible they'll support on Patron and become loyal customers that are the real value there. People who weren't buying before are now buying. It might take longer, those customers will be happier. Chances are the more popular this becomes the more content it can create. You can make some money in short term, but in my humble opinion, you'll make much more with lower prices.

Originally Posted by Icemanfrost

This is my two cents. I think it should be more reasonable the price.

I agree that having epic pachinko spins cheaper would be better, cause as its now you pay a lot for premium content aka girls cause the items dropped by pachinko you can buy or get from contests. What girls give you is 4 pieces of small "avatars" images and 3 upgrading scenes. They also give you 1 more girl of course and a bunch of cash/h. But at least for now, till the tomorrows supposed big update, cash/h is useless for old players that already maxed they upgrades.

So you basically pay 900 kobans which is quite a bit of real world money to get a single guaranteed girl, chances to spin them on a single pull are probably little to none. And the girl gives you just few pictures, nearly no story at all, one more cash button to press (which could be considered a hindrance if before and after update cash will be useless for longer players). FKG game I mentioned in my solution to OP's problem gives you 6* girls for cheaper (especially on promo deals), you can often actually choose which one you want (as you get a ticket to exchange in the shop), and you get a girl thats better than 5* and lower girls you get from events/normal gacha spins, you get a normal proper h-scene with voice-over, and a bit of story in that scene, and when they translate and add character quests you get even more story/personality of that "wifu". We will see what the big update brings, but for now for me at least what HH "premium content" gives isn't worth my time/money.

Originally Posted by Icemanfrost

(There really should be a feature to save the image when you unlock girls so you can go back to look at their scenes)

All the images you can access whenever you want, they aren't like you suggest a one-time stuff. You just go to harem portion of game and select the girl you wanna revisit the upgrade scenes and click on the 3 stars next to "Affection" label. Heck, you can actually save the images too, just right and "save image as". Doesn't save text, but saves the image.

Originally Posted by Eversor86

I agree that having epic pachinko spins cheaper would be better, cause as its now you pay a lot for premium content aka girls cause the items dropped by pachinko you can buy or get from contests. What girls give you are 4 pieces of small "avatars" images and 3 upgrading scenes. They also give you 1 more girl of course and a bunch of cash/h. But at least for now, till the tomorrows supposed big update, cash/h is useless for old players that already maxed they upgrades.

So you basically pay 900 kobans which are quite a bit of real world money to get a single guaranteed girl, chances to spin them on a single pull are probably little to none. And the girl gives you just a few pictures, nearly no story at all, one more cash button to press (which could be considered a hindrance if before and after update cash will be useless for longer players). FKG game I mentioned in my solution to OP's problem gives you 6* girls for cheaper (especially on promo deals), you can often actually choose which one you want (as you get a ticket to exchange in the shop), and you get a girl that better than 5* and lower girls you get from events/normal gacha spins, you get a normal proper h-scene with voice-over, and a bit of story in that scene, and when they translate and add character quests you get even more story/personality of that "wife". We will see what the big update brings, but for now for me at least what HH "premium content" gives isn't worth my time/money.



All the images you can access whenever you want, they aren't like you suggest a one-time stuff. You just go to harem portion of the game and select the girl you wanna revisit the upgrade scenes and click on the 3 stars next to "Affection" label. Heck, you can actually save the images too, just right and "save image as". Doesn't save text, but saves the image.

I read some where vaguely the reason for not proving a way to save the girl sex scenes in a photo gallery like other games have. They don't want it to get "too much unwanted attention" this is an adult game. I firmly believe we are mature enough to have the images saved in a neat little photo gallery without having to resort to saving the image to the PC. This is a mature game. I don't know why certain people would be offended by it.

I don't know the solution for the epic girls. I do know you want to push people to become loyal and engaged. Those people who are passionate about the game will come on the forum and en-gage. They are loyal fans. I have another suggestion. Perhaps a feature that costs 20 bucks a month. That allows you to re-charge your energy twice as fast or a bit faster than now. Perhaps it gives the free number of Korbans a month.

If it's affordable, more people will buy. Chances are they will re-buy. You also give your most loyal fans access to more content. It's just not worth it to me for the small gear and the girl for the price. You have considered how much people are willing to pay. 15-20 bucks a month seems to be sweet spot

other company's warcraft, z girls, all have sub type of service. I never paid for the epic roll when I first played thw and on to recharge my energy. I mostly waited with great paitence to build up my money. An automated system for the money, where you don't have log in every six hours would be helpful. Perhaps for Sub service, you can offer free automation for money as a way encourage people to sign up.

Originally Posted by Icemanfrost

I read some where vaguely the reason for not proving a way to save the girl sex scenes in a photo gallery like other games have. They don't want it to get "too much unwanted attention" this is an adult game. I firmly believe we are mature enough to have the images saved in a neat little photo gallery without having to resort to saving the image to the PC. This is a mature game. I don't know why certain people would be offended by it.

You can already view the images again at ANY time after you unlock them, without saving them to your PC. That's what the guy you quoted told you... They just don't want them posted online without their permission, because they want to keep it as the lure for people to actually play the game.

The game is pretty flawed and a bit barebones compared to other games on Nutaku whose premium Gacha girls actually progresses the game and makes things easier or challenging

Look at Kamihime, Aigis, Flower Knight,

The,re is no incentive to spend real money on this game once you get a handful of girls to provide money to buy equipment and affection and you will be at a higher level to get stamina to progress which is a bit slow

If you want to collect girls for the sake of collection the game for you

Otherwise those who prefer action or another gameplay over click and grind low drops - I got played the game for 6 months and just lost interest

Well... yeah? Harem Heroes sets out to offer a linear, comic-like story. In that regard, it accomplishes its goal. This is not another Kamihime or Flower Knight Girl. It isn't intended to be those games - it is its own experience. Admittedly, Harem Heroes is a simple game in both concept and design. I feel Kinkoid would benefit if they took the time to implement new and requested features such as guilds and an in-game chat. Both of these would generate additional interest and could introduce new, community centered quests and raid bosses which can only be finished with the efforts of multiple players.

And what's your proposed solution? Advertise other games? That doesn't help nor benefit Harem Heroes in any shape or form. It only tells us that Harem Heroes isn't your cup of tea.

Originally Posted by Icemanfrost

I don't know the solution for the epic girls. I do know you want to push people to become loyal and engaged. Those people who are passionate about the game will come on the forum and en-gage. They are loyal fans. I have another suggestion. Perhaps a feature that costs 20 bucks a month. That allows you to re-charge your energy twice as fast or a bit faster than now. Perhaps it gives the free number of Korbans a month.
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Most of the active/hardcore players and some of the developers are on the Discord server.

Now this topic's original post does try suggest a way to revamp all aspects of the game into a more unified bigger picture, meaning that it is tinkering with both the "premium" and the "standard".... I think? Wait, no, he specifically said that some girls would continue to be pachinko exclusive (but they'd always be possible drops and they'd just be much more likely to drop from the pachinko during their event than they are outside of it) and the "black market" selection would be limited to the event girls who are NOT designated as pachinko exclusives. So the divide between "premium" content and "standard" content is still there.

You might want to re-read what OP wrote. He suggested bringing back all old event girls and have them be accessible via "event booster and suggested Bunny's mother, an Epic Pachinko exclusive, as an example. OP was trying to find a way to obtain premium content for free.

The part that you read from OP's post was of him suggesting that new Epic Pachinko exclusive girls remain Epic Pachinko exclusive for the initial release and suggested that they have an increased drop rate. Event girls already have an increased drop rate for their events, so the booster suggestion is kind of pointless.

Well, the question you need to ask is: how much players pay now enough to get the 3 girls for each event and how much players would be susceptible to pay for the event girl if the cost would be very low (for example 1event girl = 5$)

If the result is that putting 1 girl for 5$ give a bigger profit than now, so, just do it

People who paid 100$ doesn't have weight in the balance, they didn't get the money back with a lower price. They lost their money forever and prices change, that's all; it's just like people who pays an apple phone 1000$ and 6 month later, the same phone cost 300$. It's unfair, but it's life.
If you really want doing something for them, give them 20 chance to have event girls in the future.

And sorry about my bad english

Originally Posted by Shad0w

You might want to re-read what OP wrote. He suggested bringing back all old event girls and have them be accessible via "event booster and suggested Bunny's mother, an Epic Pachinko exclusive, as an example. OP was trying to find a way to obtain premium content for free.

The part that you read from OP's post was of him suggesting that new Epic Pachinko exclusive girls remain Epic Pachinko exclusive for the initial release and suggested that they have an increased drop rate. Event girls already have an increased drop rate for their events, so the booster suggestion is kind of pointless.

Sounds like a poorly chosen example for the point that was being described, maybe a misunderstanding (and failure in fact-checking) on their part about how the events so far have been organized. (As you point out, it hasn't been a perfect divide where the troll-dropped girls are always new characters and the pachinko exclusives are always variations. There are exceptions in both cases.) Doesn't change what the idea was about. Just means it was a bad example. He could have instead mentioned either of Bunny's sisters for that example.

But the idea proposed a "black market" shop which would host the "idols" and the troll-dropped girls from all events, and then with enough tokens (aka the "event booster", which is an awkward and misleading name for the type of item that it was described as being (they don't boost anything, they're just currency)) awarded from the 14 event dailies to be able to afford either an "idol" or two troll-dropped girls from this "black market". (Potential would exist to obtain extra tokens as random drops, or you could pay kobans for them.) He misspoke with the assertion of the "new girl" / "variation" divide between what options had been in which place, but the intention was clearly that only the "idols" and the troll-dropped girls would be in this "black market", and the pachinko exclusives would still be pachinko exclusives.

It's probably wishful thinking for the full "black market" selection to drop in price whenever any event is running though. I'd imagine that the current event's girls would be introduced at the cheaper price and then go up to full price after the event and stay there. (Maybe they could get a slight discount offered when their event returns or when a big promo similar to the anniversary deal happens again?)

Anyway, about the pachinko, the idea proposed that the pachinko exclusive event girls would ALWAYS be available in the pachinko but they'd just be much more likely to drop during their event than they'll be outside of the event. Maybe they already have better odds to drop than a non-event girl? (Not in my experience when I've used my saved up free kobans during an event. I've only gotten non-event girls. But it is "higher chance", not "guaranteed".) But the proposal was clearly about the availability, not the drop rate. Currently event girls which are pachinko exclusives become unavailable to find after the event ends, zero chance. I'd think that it ought to be set up so that pachinko drops should be weighted so that "current exclusives > non-event possibilities > previous exclusives".

Hmmm, this wasn't stated in the topic creator's idea but a logical follow-up point about the pachinko would be that the non-exclusives (the troll-dropped girls) would still disappear from pachinko when their event ends (if they would even still be included in it to begin with, maybe they'd just be black market exclusives instead). Only the exclusives would stick around.

I kept saying "troll-dropped" in this post, but I suppose I should have just said kidnapped. The two girls featured in the event's spotlight as having been taken by a troll. Oh well.