Thread: Re-balance Feedbacks

So I assume that this info that's now on the wiki is accurate for the current game?

Required Affection to reach 1 Star = [Haremette Number] x 15
Required Affection to reach 2 Stars = [Haremette Number] x 65
Required Affection to reach 3 Stars = [Haremette Number] x 215
Required Affection to reach 4 Stars = [Haremette Number] x 915
Required Affection to reach 5 Stars = [Haremette Number] x 2,665

And it looks like these are grand totals to get there from nothing. These are not the values to get there from the previous star. Anyway, I just wanted to look that over and get a better perspective of the scaling, specifically using 1 rare lingerie (worth 100 affection) as the measuring stick and assuming no other affection items are used. A rundown after throwing some numbers around in a spreadsheet.....

Girl 6: * = 1 item, ** = 4 items, *** = 13 items, **** = 55 items, ***** = 160 items
Girl 13: * = 2 items, ** = 9 items, *** = 28 items, **** = 119 items, ***** = 347 items
Girl 20: * = 3 items, ** = 13 items, *** = 43 items, **** = 183 items, ***** = 555 items
Girl 26: * = 4 items, ** = 17 items, *** = 56 items, **** = 238 items, ***** = 693 items
Girl 33: * = 5 items, ** = 22 items, *** = 71 items, **** = 302 items, ***** = 880 items
Girl 40: * = 6 items, ** = 26 items, *** = 86 items, **** = 366 items, ***** = 1066 items
Girl 46: * = 7 items, ** = 30 items, *** = 99 items, **** = 421 items, ***** = 1226 items
Girl 52: * = 8 items, ** = 34 items, *** = 112 items, **** = 476 items, ***** = 1386 items
Girl 60: * = 9 items, ** = 39 items, *** = 129 items, **** = 549 items, ***** = 1599 items

Those measurements might not be so bad if the reference was a smaller affection item, like the common chocolates (25 affection) for example. 1600 common chocolates would be equal to 400 rare lingerie, which is still a lot of items but it's not as far out there. But for those numbers if they're rare lingerie things got pretty excessive starting somewhere in the 3 star range there (like by girl 25 or so).

Anyway, a brief summary of everything I came up with by throwing a spreadsheet together:
* Each next group of 6-7 girls sees it require 1 more item than the previous group to reach 1 star.
* Each next 1-2 girls see it require 1 more item than the previous 1-2 girls to reach 2 stars.
* Each next girl requires about 2-3 more items than the previous girl to reach 3 stars.
* It will be about 9-10 more items than the previous girl for 4 stars.
* And it will be about about 26-27 more items than the previous girl for 5 stars.

Thinking about the way things grouped up there... I'd actually kind of think that they should have picked multipliers that would produce a pattern more along the lines of:
* Each next group of 6-7 girls sees it require 1 more item than the previous group to reach 1 star.
* Each next group of 4-5 girls sees it require 1 more item than the previous group to reach 2 stars.
* Each next group of 2-3 girls sees it require 1 more item than the previous group to reach 3 stars.
* Each next girl sees it require 2-3 more items than the previous girl to reach 4 stars.
* Each next girl sees it require 4-5 more items than the previous girl to reach 5 stars.

Side note looking at their multipliers (15, 65, 215, 915, and 2665):
* 2nd value is x4.33 larger than 1st value
* 3rd value is x3.31 larger than 2nd value
* 4th value is x4.26 larger than 3rd value
* 5th value is x2.91 larger than 4th value

Why are the steps so uneven? It kind of seems like they should have picked values that would either climb at a flat rate (each one x3.5 larger than the previous one, for example) or that would climb at an increasing rate (x2.5, x3, x3.5, and x4, for example).

Of course any tweaks to these values will have a huge impact on how the entire affection system feels at different levels. I don't know where the best balance would be found.

Edit: Actually, about the values being a multiple of the girl's placement in the list, that right there is not a great implementation because it would be really nice if we could someday get some options to sort our list however we want and that's not likely to happen while order influences affection leveling costs. (They wouldn't want us bumping someone to early in the list to get a discount.)

Originally Posted by MuljoStpho

Side note looking at their multipliers (15, 65, 215, 915, and 2665):
* 2nd value is x4.33 larger than 1st value
* 3rd value is x3.31 larger than 2nd value
* 4th value is x4.26 larger than 3rd value
* 5th value is x2.91 larger than 4th value

Why are the steps so uneven? It kind of seems like they should have picked values that would either climb at a flat rate (each one x3.5 larger than the previous one, for example) or that would climb at an increasing rate (x2.5, x3, x3.5, and x4, for example).

15 for star 1, an additional 50 for star 2 (15x3 + 5), an additional 150 (50x3) for star 3, an additional 700 (150x3 + 250) for star 4 and an additional 1750 (700*3 - 350) for star 5. It uses a x3 multiplier and a modifier for each step, so that's why it gets the results it gets. The growth of the values comes from a pattern in the between between stars rather than the total, it looks weird though.

I just upgraded Bunny to 5 star for ~1million and her income went from 3800/h to 4000/h wow...

Originally Posted by Dari

I just upgraded Bunny to 5 star for ~1million and her income went from 3800/h to 4000/h wow...

It gets worse, on your 50th girl you will be paying 50 times as much when they add the 5th star to that girl and that doesn't even include the affection items you needed to use.

Can anyone give me a confirmation one way or another on something?

For a while after the update it seemed like I got less money from the harem but I got it a lot faster. Now it seems like the time has gone back up but the amount they give has stayed lower. Has anyone noticed this or payed close enough attention before that they can confirm a change to make the harem money take longer.

Originally Posted by Darkrider

Can anyone give me a confirmation one way or another on something?

For a while after the update it seemed like I got less money from the harem but I got it a lot faster. Now it seems like the time has gone back up but the amount they give has stayed lower. Has anyone noticed this or payed close enough attention before that they can confirm a change to make the harem money take longer.

It doesn't seem to have changed since the update for me, though I can only speak for all 3 star girls.

My best advice for the devs would be to ditch the bots in the battle mode. Its supposed to be PvP anyway. Its not fair if I'm competing against others who are getting twice as much or even three times as much mojo for a fight because they're not getting bots.

Additionally its clear that the affection prices are way out of sync. I have no problem with them believing there needs to be a re-balance. That wasn't it. There isn't any built in extra funding at higher levels except that they have more girls. If they can't afford to get them to top affection, its actually a disadvantage. Trying to get affection from epic pachinko is also a losing cause as that costs more at each level. Perhaps we shouldn't have been able to raise affection as easily as we did in the past, but it shouldn't take a week to raise a girl to top level without emptying out your account.

Originally Posted by Darkrider

Can anyone give me a confirmation one way or another on something?

For a while after the update it seemed like I got less money from the harem but I got it a lot faster. Now it seems like the time has gone back up but the amount they give has stayed lower. Has anyone noticed this or payed close enough attention before that they can confirm a change to make the harem money take longer.

I am taking in about 20K less now than before if all are ready to harvest. They do have shorter regen periods but I'm not always able to take advantage of that, especially on work days.

Originally Posted by soviras

15 for star 1, an additional 50 for star 2 (15x3 + 5), an additional 150 (50x3) for star 3, an additional 600 (150x3 + 150) for star 4 and an additional 1750 (600*3 - 50) for star 5. It uses a x3 multiplier and a modifier for each step, so that's why it gets the results it gets. The growth of the values comes from a pattern in the between between stars rather than the total, it looks weird though.

4 star requires additional 700, thats 3 times 150 + 250 going by your idea XD.

Originally Posted by soviras

It gets worse, on your 50th girl you will be paying 50 times as much when they add the 5th star to that girl and that doesn't even include the affection items you needed to use.

Assuming the math is correct then affection points needed and thus cost of acquiring them is basically also multiplication, so getting to 5 star is 50 times more expensive on 50th girl overall, no need to exclude affection items needed to use.

I suspect the guy included affection cost, cause upgrade alone was below 800k IIRC.

Originally Posted by Darkrider

Can anyone give me a confirmation one way or another on something?

For a while after the update it seemed like I got less money from the harem but I got it a lot faster. Now it seems like the time has gone back up but the amount they give has stayed lower. Has anyone noticed this or payed close enough attention before that they can confirm a change to make the harem money take longer.

I already wrote a huge post about it, and then a summarizing post about it. In simple terms:

- Starting 4 girls got their cash per collect up. 2 of them got their timers actually increased on 4/5*, other 2 on 3* got it smaller. Overall cash/h gone up.
- Princess Agate also got her cash per collect and cash/h up, and timer between collects down.
- All other story girls (troll drops and story drops) got their cash/h drop down at most by 30%. Their timers between collect gone down, and cash per collect actually in most cases also gone down.
- All event or epic pachinko girls got their cash/h increased even close to 2.5 times. Cash per collect gone up, time between collects mostly down.

So summing up you get on average less money per collect, thats why your full harem collecting dropped down. But times between collecting also dropped and they did far more than the cash sums being collected. So even if your full harem collect gone down, your cash/h from harem has probably gone up assuming efficient collecting.

What they did is, they made harem require far more busy-work to get good cash/h, which for people that log and collect once per while means less cash/h than before.

You know, I think that I more of less know what was going in their heads when they worked on this update. People whined that girls drop to slow, that getting them is to hard. So they increased their drops, but also gave us free kobans on daily missions being all done each day. Cause of this getting all girls from story and events will be far easier, and also with just kobans from daily missions we will be able to get a single pachinko girl each 36 days, so with some other bonus kobans here and there - probably as often as we get events.

Thus their only source of income from premium currency is collecting money in harem (thats why harem cash per collect/timers got so fucked up), from restoring shop (thats why you need such a shit large number of items and why refreshing cost more than before), and from upgrading the affection stars (thats why they gone for the slopped rising costs), theres still the buy girls via epic pachinko if one wanted to get all event girls on each event.

So in overall things look at first go far easier to F2P, but the moment you see how expensive affections are, it will be the moment you probably will start considering this game being dropped. I could harbor a guess that they moved premium content from girls themselves to affection scenes. Cause now it will be harder to upgrade affection, rather than get the girls.

What I plan to do is to wait till I get the Kalisa from story (or what ever was her name). Then for next event to see if we will still get a nice kobans on event dailies. The girls will let me judge how fucking expensive the affection is, and probably not upgrade it if its the analyzed multiplication or worse. Afterwards I will just wait for some signal from the Devs, if they collected our feedback in email or this forum, and if they are actually planning to make a fast big re-balance update 3.0. If they will fix PvP, completely broken stats balance that we have now, and change affection to a maybe high but mostly static one not the slopped up we have to punish players who play longer more and more the longer they play. The judgment will be based on how long it will take them to response, on what the response is, and the verdict will be if I will ditch this game or continue to play for just story (aka doing nothing else part it), as personally I don't believe in them to much o.0 (so I assume they will respond negatively, maybe changing few small unimportant stuff, or don't answer at all and consider asking us to write mails to them their already said answer).

EDIT:
It seems we got event already, so I will probably get event girls faster than I mange to progress basically last story quest to get Kalisa. The trolls with event girls are Dark Lord and Edwarda.

The scaling affection is a terrible idea, I have 40+ girls, and to upgrade a new one i need over 150 rare gifts.So now I need to wait for months just so I can upgrade one girl??? Please remove this as it is not a good game mechanic.