Thread: Kamihime General Discussion + Q&A

Hi all. I was wondering if you guys could help me with team building since I don’t fully understand debuff frames and what not. So my team is composed of Cthulu, Ryu-oh (Dragon King), and Shiva, what should I use for the 4th? And is this team good? I heard Cthulu and Ryu-oh are really good water SSRs. Anyways I’m stuck between Amaterasu SSR, Enkidu a water SR, or Nike SR for heals. I also have Tyr and Azazel for SSRs but they’re probs irrelevant in this case. Finally what Hero should I get with what additional ability? I messed up and got Solomon, and Arthur when I first started, but I also have Mordred and I almost have enough for D’art and Morgan. Suggestions?

Originally Posted by xxMidnightxx

Hi all. I was wondering if you guys could help me with team building since I don’t fully understand debuff frames and what not. So my team is composed of Cthulu, Ryu-oh (Dragon King), and Shiva, what should I use for the 4th? And is this team good? I heard Cthulu and Ryu-oh are really good water SSRs. Anyways I’m stuck between Amaterasu SSR, Enkidu a water SR, or Nike SR for heals. I also have Tyr and Azazel for SSRs but they’re probs irrelevant in this case. Finally what Hero should I get with what additional ability? I messed up and got Solomon, and Arthur when I first started, but I also have Mordred and I almost have enough for D’art and Morgan. Suggestions?

Your setup is kinda awkward, as Cthulu and Ryu-oh, even though they have 2 of the best skillsets in the game, don't synergize well.

To give you an idea of how "perfect water teams" work, Cthulu and SSR Nike have 2 extremely complementary sets, as they cover A frame Attack down, A Frame defense down, C frame defense down and Heal. Add SSR Water Raphael (not released yet, she is probably the next available SSR) and you cover B frame debuffs as well. Those 3 are like the Water trinity.

As for the last slot in a perfect Water Party (let's talk about the ideal situation first and about your options afterwards), the best options are probably Sol (works extremely well with it, but isn't Water so you lose some damage), Aphrodite, or Ryu-Oh.

Ryu-Oh has A frame Attack Down, A frame Defense down, and her Block Propaganda like skill (increases overdrive max charge). The 3 skills are outstanding, but the Cthulu + SSR Nike already cover 2 of those so the lose most their value. C'thulu's A frame attack debuff is slightly weaker than Ryu-Oh's, so you will still get a really noticable effect, but even though Ryu-oh's Def debuff is stronger than Nike's, the Trinity already reaches the 50% debuff cap, so the effect will not be that noticable. If anything, having 2 duplicate skills will allow you to miss one of them without losing value, which is really nice in general.
If you're going to use Ty-Oh anyways, note that replacing SSR Nike by Aphrodite is a real option. Assuming Ryu-oh is already in your party, Aphrodite will be better than SSR Nike on bosses where Cleanse is useful, and SSR Nike should be slightly better otherwise.

If you use Sol (reduces enemy Attack by a huge margin, gives a heal and an outstanding support toolbox, but isn't Water so you lose about 20% of your total damage) or Aphrodite (gives a heal and a good support toolbox) instead, you're almost commited to have Mordred as your Soul (or, at the very least, her Black Propaganda skill as EX), which is a restriction Ryu-Oh wouldn't have, but the restriction isn't that bad since the team covers so many things that you don't really need more from your Soul anyways. With Ryu-Oh, the Soul is really open (Andromeda when you don't need anything else) and the EX will mostly be Mordred's debuff resist down, sometimes Vivian's Debuff remover whenever it's need on a boss, and I would recommenc using Cassiopeia with Mordred's debuff resist down over another Soul with Chaos Magic as Ex whenever the Buff remover is needed.


Finally there are options where you can replace Water Raphael with D'artagnan's Sniper Shot. For a summary, your options for a team that could be considered 100% completed are:

C'thulu + SSR Nike + Water Raphael + Ryu-Oh
C'thulu + Aphrodite + Water Raphael + Ryu-Oh
C'thulu + Water Raphael + Ryu-Oh + Sol
C'thulu + SSR Nike + Water Raphael + Aphrodite (Black Prop on Soul)
C'thulu + SSR Nike + Water Raphael + Sol (Black Prop on Soul)
C'thulu + SSR Nike + Ryu-Oh + Aphrodite (Sniper Shot on Soul)
C'thulu + SSR Nike + Ryu-Oh + Sol (Sniper Shot on Soul)
C'thulu + SSR Nike + Aphrodite + Sol (Soul is Mordred with Sniper Shot)


The good news for you is, you can get teams that perform almost as well by even if you only have 3 of the 6 Hime that have already been mentionned, as you already have 2 of those and will have a third with the Miracle Ticket.

As you have C'thulu, Ryu-Oh and Shiva, and you can't get Water Raphael with Miracle tickets yet, which leaves you with SSR Nike, Aphrodite and Sol. You lack B frame Debuff on your Soul, so you will be restricted to have Sniper Shot, which limits you a lot.
As getting Mordred's Affliction resist down will be difficult when stuck with Sniper Shot. The only options being D'art with is as Ex or Mordred with Sniper Shot, which isn't too bad in general, but having a duplicate skill again (Black Propapanga and Ryu-Oh) feels awkward. The other option is to go with another option (like Andromeda with Sniper Shot) and sacrifice the debuff resist.
As a side note, be aware that it is totally possible to cut Shiva from the team for Amaterasu which covers Sniper Shot whenever a boss realy forces you tu use another Ex. Amaterasu is strictly worse than Water Raphael in a Water team, but is still really good in some cases.

Basically, in the end, the best options you have are:
- SSR Nike: The standard pick a Water Team would want after C'thulu, not as good for you as you have Ryu-Oh. If you pick SSR Nike, you would have to use Amaterasu over Shiva to free your Ex slot for a Cleanse whenever it's required on a boss (The boss debuffs your team).
- Aphrodite: Will be slightly worse than SSR Nike for the majority of bosses, but better when Cleanse has value.
- Sol: Sol has a Cleanse as well, a significant Attack lowering tool, a Buff remover (other 2 would have to run Cassiopeia when one is needed as Sol has more freedom), but has the big drawback of making your team deal almost 20% less damage.

Sol is probably better as long as Nutaku doesn't have the 50% Attack down cap, but this will happen at some point (I think it's soon?). After this, the other 2 are probably better by a little margin, but are way less versatile for other elements.

If I was you, I would pick:
- Sol if you plan to use your other Elements at some point, since she's basically strong in any single team
- SSR Nike or Aphrodite if you plan to only use Water in the future. I have a preference for Nike, but that's really personal, and everyone would give a different opinion

By the way, you should have understood by reading, but D'artagnan should be your next Soul. Then probably Andromeda afterwards. Joan is really good but you already have Ryu-Oh that has the same Attack Debuff so she loses value, and Siegfried is basically a Soul good at getting a lot of PP if you spam your seeds during event Burst Time and has close to no value otherwise, so her value depends on your Burst Time activity

Originally Posted by Sfay

--
Sol is probably better as long as Nutaku doesn't have the 50% Attack down cap, but this will happen at some point (I think it's soon?).--

Japan got it on Valentine patch. So we're about two months away.

Originally Posted by Sfay

Your setup is kinda awkward, as Cthulu and Ryu-oh, even though they have 2 of the best skillsets in the game, don't synergize well.

To give you an idea of how "perfect water teams" work, Cthulu and SSR Nike have 2 extremely complementary sets, as they cover A frame Attack down, A Frame defense down, C frame defense down and Heal. Add SSR Water Raphael (not released yet, she is probably the next available SSR) and you cover B frame debuffs as well. Those 3 are like the Water trinity.

As for the last slot in a perfect Water Party (let's talk about the ideal situation first and about your options afterwards), the best options are probably Sol (works extremely well with it, but isn't Water so you lose some damage), Aphrodite, or Ryu-Oh.

Ryu-Oh has A frame Attack Down, A frame Defense down, and her Block Propaganda like skill (increases overdrive max charge). The 3 skills are outstanding, but the Cthulu + SSR Nike already cover 2 of those so the lose most their value. C'thulu's A frame attack debuff is slightly weaker than Ryu-Oh's, so you will still get a really noticable effect, but even though Ryu-oh's Def debuff is stronger than Nike's, the Trinity already reaches the 50% debuff cap, so the effect will not be that noticable. If anything, having 2 duplicate skills will allow you to miss one of them without losing value, which is really nice in general.
If you're going to use Ty-Oh anyways, note that replacing SSR Nike by Aphrodite is a real option. Assuming Ryu-oh is already in your party, Aphrodite will be better than SSR Nike on bosses where Cleanse is useful, and SSR Nike should be slightly better otherwise.

If you use Sol (reduces enemy Attack by a huge margin, gives a heal and an outstanding support toolbox, but isn't Water so you lose about 20% of your total damage) or Aphrodite (gives a heal and a good support toolbox) instead, you're almost commited to have Mordred as your Soul (or, at the very least, her Black Propaganda skill as EX), which is a restriction Ryu-Oh wouldn't have, but the restriction isn't that bad since the team covers so many things that you don't really need more from your Soul anyways. With Ryu-Oh, the Soul is really open (Andromeda when you don't need anything else) and the EX will mostly be Mordred's debuff resist down, sometimes Vivian's Debuff remover whenever it's need on a boss, and I would recommenc using Cassiopeia with Mordred's debuff resist down over another Soul with Chaos Magic as Ex whenever the Buff remover is needed.


Finally there are options where you can replace Water Raphael with D'artagnan's Sniper Shot. For a summary, your options for a team that could be considered 100% completed are:

C'thulu + SSR Nike + Water Raphael + Ryu-Oh
C'thulu + Aphrodite + Water Raphael + Ryu-Oh
C'thulu + Water Raphael + Ryu-Oh + Sol
C'thulu + SSR Nike + Water Raphael + Aphrodite (Black Prop on Soul)
C'thulu + SSR Nike + Water Raphael + Sol (Black Prop on Soul)
C'thulu + SSR Nike + Ryu-Oh + Aphrodite (Sniper Shot on Soul)
C'thulu + SSR Nike + Ryu-Oh + Sol (Sniper Shot on Soul)
C'thulu + SSR Nike + Aphrodite + Sol (Soul is Mordred with Sniper Shot)


The good news for you is, you can get teams that perform almost as well by even if you only have 3 of the 6 Hime that have already been mentionned, as you already have 2 of those and will have a third with the Miracle Ticket.

As you have C'thulu, Ryu-Oh and Shiva, and you can't get Water Raphael with Miracle tickets yet, which leaves you with SSR Nike, Aphrodite and Sol. You lack B frame Debuff on your Soul, so you will be restricted to have Sniper Shot, which limits you a lot.
As getting Mordred's Affliction resist down will be difficult when stuck with Sniper Shot. The only options being D'art with is as Ex or Mordred with Sniper Shot, which isn't too bad in general, but having a duplicate skill again (Black Propapanga and Ryu-Oh) feels awkward. The other option is to go with another option (like Andromeda with Sniper Shot) and sacrifice the debuff resist.
As a side note, be aware that it is totally possible to cut Shiva from the team for Amaterasu which covers Sniper Shot whenever a boss realy forces you tu use another Ex. Amaterasu is strictly worse than Water Raphael in a Water team, but is still really good in some cases.

Basically, in the end, the best options you have are:
- SSR Nike: The standard pick a Water Team would want after C'thulu, not as good for you as you have Ryu-Oh. If you pick SSR Nike, you would have to use Amaterasu over Shiva to free your Ex slot for a Cleanse whenever it's required on a boss (The boss debuffs your team).
- Aphrodite: Will be slightly worse than SSR Nike for the majority of bosses, but better when Cleanse has value.
- Sol: Sol has a Cleanse as well, a significant Attack lowering tool, a Buff remover (other 2 would have to run Cassiopeia when one is needed as Sol has more freedom), but has the big drawback of making your team deal almost 20% less damage.

Sol is probably better as long as Nutaku doesn't have the 50% Attack down cap, but this will happen at some point (I think it's soon?). After this, the other 2 are probably better by a little margin, but are way less versatile for other elements.

If I was you, I would pick:
- Sol if you plan to use your other Elements at some point, since she's basically strong in any single team
- SSR Nike or Aphrodite if you plan to only use Water in the future. I have a preference for Nike, but that's really personal, and everyone would give a different opinion

By the way, you should have understood by reading, but D'artagnan should be your next Soul. Then probably Andromeda afterwards. Joan is really good but you already have Ryu-Oh that has the same Attack Debuff so she loses value, and Siegfried is basically a Soul good at getting a lot of PP if you spam your seeds during event Burst Time and has close to no value otherwise, so her value depends on your Burst Time activity

Bruh this is a godsend reply! Thank you so much brother! So yeah I had Ryu-Oh and Shiva already and just miracle Cthulu. Im loving the Cthulu, SSR Nike/Aphro, Water Raphael, and Ryu-Oh recommendation. I’ll probs try to get this. I’m not a hardcore player or anything but based on what I have, what would be the best option rn or decent setup while I w8 to get a hold on the rest? Considering I’ll have D’art with Affliction resist down very soon as well if needed so I’m mainly missing C-frame debuff right? U also made debuffs more clearer to me. Am I getting this right? So abilities in different frame tiers stack in debuff say attack/def down, but same tiers don’t and just misses? And are A frames the strongest? Last but not least, is there a way to tell which debuff is in which frame w/o knowing? Tysm!

Originally Posted by xxMidnightxx

--So abilities in different frame tiers stack in debuff say attack/def down, but same tiers don’t and just misses?

Yes. A weaker B debuff (like Mordred's 10% Outrage) will just miss against a stronger B debuff (like Dartagnan's 20% Sniper Shot). Sniper Shot will overwrite Outrage, but this is currently bugged, so make sure to apply Sniper Shot first.

Originally Posted by xxMidnightxx

And are A frames the strongest?

No... well, SSR Amon has -25% which is currently outmatched. But -50% is the cap (for Def, no cap on Atk debuffs until valentine).

Originally Posted by xxMidnightxx

Last but not least, is there a way to tell which debuff is in which frame w/o knowing? Tysm!

One way is the encyclopedia in Sanahtlig's toolbox gives you a quick peek on all the skills, including upcoming ones.