Thread: SSR Gacha Ticket Question

Originally Posted by Saberborn

How often does the game sell those purple limit breaking materials? I know they are in the shop... but only extreme whales can afford those. I've only seen it sold as part of the New Years gacha. Anyone know how often DMM has had those gachas? Even if it's once every quarter then over the span of 9 months you could have a MLB himeless SSR weapon.

They're also farmable from Tower events.

Whales on DMM version regret not buying more of those when the final LB was implemented.

Best part is, they'll get the additional skill even w/o LB (while KH weapons require final LB).

But mind that NOT all of the kamiless SSRs are the best. 1/3 of them are defender weapons, which are not quite useful (except the fire hammer that gets assault as 2nd skill); and those getting combo atk rate skill are just okay; the burst and pride skills are truly the best (not available to Dark and Light though).

Even at this time, with no LB and no extra skill, the assault SSRs are comparable with good SRs, as their lower base stats are offset by higher skill effect.

Originally Posted by Wanderer

-- the burst -- skills are truly the best --

Wait, what? Burst is usually a complete trash tier stat. I could look this up from the JP wiki, but save me the bother?

Also, rather than using the SSR limit break materials on the Shop weapons, wouldn't those be better used on Relic weapons?
Unless you're interesting in only one weapon for one element, the Regalia farm is likely going to be just utterly INSANE otherwise.

I think the exceed is good because it gives you the same effect with Shingen's 2nd skill.

Originally Posted by Slashley

Wait, what? Burst is usually a complete trash tier stat. I could look this up from the JP wiki, but save me the bother?

Saved you the bother and looked it up, it's apparently supposed to amplify burst damage and raise the damage cap of burst... if what Google translate says is accurate. Quite the useful tool for burst teams I'd wager.

Putting aside the fact that two weapon skills are usually better than one, and you won't have a wide selection of SSR weapons to choose from, equippable Burst buffs are not especially good, and I explain why in my Accessory buff guide.

Remember that Burst damage starts with a 5x rather than a 1x multipler (for SSR kamihime). Therefore any Burst buff's effect should be divided by 5 to approximate the effect on damage. Shingen's ability is a +200% buff, which is why it's so powerful. To get the same effect with weapon skills, you'd need 7 SLVL20 (small effect) weapons, which would yield +42% Burst damage. Meanwhile, 7 equivalent Assault skill weapons would give you +70% character attack, or +31.5% damage. Would you rather have +31.5% damage all the time, or +42% damage on Bursts only?

In short, Shingen is good because her Burst buff (+42% Burst damage) is uncommonly strong vs. the alternatives available for character ATK (e.g., +9% damage from Arthur). Throughout the rest of the game, you don't see that same lopsided ratio.

Originally Posted by sanahtlig

Putting aside the fact that two weapon skills are usually better than one, and you won't have a wide selection of SSR weapons to choose from, equippable Burst buffs are not especially good, and I explain why in my Accessory buff guide.

Remember that Burst damage starts with a 5x rather than a 1x multipler (for SSR kamihime). Therefore any Burst buff's effect should be divided by 5 to approximate the effect on damage. Shingen's ability is a +200% buff, which is why it's so powerful. To get the same effect with weapon skills, you'd need 7 SLVL20 (small effect) weapons, which would yield +42% Burst damage. Meanwhile, 7 equivalent Assault skill weapons would give you +70% character attack, or +31.5% damage. Would you rather have +31.5% damage all the time, or +42% damage on Bursts only?

In short, Shingen is good because her Burst buff (+42% Burst damage) is uncommonly strong vs. the alternatives available for character ATK (e.g., +9% damage from Arthur). Throughout the rest of the game, you don't see that same lopsided ratio.

Man, the damage calculation in this game is really dang complicated. What's the overall formula for burst calculation? Also, if the damage cap increase from the weapon burst buff I see in the JP wiki is actually valid, is that a good reason to run a dual skill weapon having burst buff?

Originally Posted by Cobblemaniac

Man, the damage calculation in this game is really dang complicated. What's the overall formula for burst calculation? Also, if the damage cap increase from the weapon burst buff I see in the JP wiki is actually valid, is that a good reason to run a dual skill weapon having burst buff?

The formula is listed here, if you can read Japanese: http://xn--hckqz0e9cygq471ahu9b.xn--...BC%8F#c85da2b9

The damage cap increase applies only to Burst damage, judging by the Japanese wording. It'll only help you if you're already at the cap, e.g., from Shingen's buff. My SSR kamihime's Burst damage shouldn't be any more than 500k, even with Shingen's full +100% buff, so I don't see the damage cap impacting me with current effects and equipment. With double +100% eidolons hitting the cap becomes more likely, but I don't expect to ever be in that situation. And in any case, this isn't practically relevant since the majority of endgame players right now don't have a full grid of SSRs, so that choosing between SSR weapons is even necessary.

Originally Posted by sanahtlig

Putting aside the fact that two weapon skills are usually better than one, and you won't have a wide selection of SSR weapons to choose from, equippable Burst buffs are not especially good, and I explain why in my Accessory buff guide.

Remember that Burst damage starts with a 5x rather than a 1x multipler (for SSR kamihime). Therefore any Burst buff's effect should be divided by 5 to approximate the effect on damage. Shingen's ability is a +200% buff, which is why it's so powerful. To get the same effect with weapon skills, you'd need 7 SLVL20 (small effect) weapons, which would yield +42% Burst damage. Meanwhile, 7 equivalent Assault skill weapons would give you +70% character attack, or +31.5% damage. Would you rather have +31.5% damage all the time, or +42% damage on Bursts only?

In short, Shingen is good because her Burst buff (+42% Burst damage) is uncommonly strong vs. the alternatives available for character ATK (e.g., +9% damage from Arthur). Throughout the rest of the game, you don't see that same lopsided ratio.

Good math, just totally missed the point, which is so obvious:
1. As Cobblemaniac said, the CAP.
2. Kamiless SSRs with burst skill have assualt skill as well.

Originally Posted by sanahtlig

The formula is listed here, if you can read Japanese: http://xn--hckqz0e9cygq471ahu9b.xn--...BC%8F#c85da2b9

The damage cap increase applies only to Burst damage, judging by the Japanese wording. It'll only help you if you're already at the cap, e.g., from Shingen's buff. My SSR kamihime's Burst damage shouldn't be any more than 500k, even with Shingen's full +100% buff, so I don't see the damage cap impacting me with current effects and equipment. With double +100% eidolons hitting the cap becomes more likely, but I don't expect to ever be in that situation. And in any case, this isn't practically relevant since the majority of endgame players right now don't have a full grid of SSRs, so that choosing between SSR weapons is even necessary.

Majority of endgame players on DMM version (don't think Nutaku version is anything near "endgame") HAVE a full grid of SSRs and often hit the cap.

At its core, burst damage is {normal_attack_damage * (A + burst_buff)} + B
A and B depend on rarity (of the main weapon or the kamihime herself) as well as whether there's the improvement from 3* or not. A's the important one, B's just a small constant.
For your soul, A varies from 2 (R) to 4.5 (3* SSR). B varies from 1500 to 2500.
For kamihime, A varies from 3 (SR) to 5 (3* SSR) or 5.5 (awakened SSR). B scales at the same rate as for the soul. The table on the wiki actually doesn't list what A is for R's. Not that you'd use R's if you can avoid it... but I can say that burst damage overall is pretty lackluster with my fire team consisting of 3 R's :P

And to be complete, burst streak damage is based off of burst damage done that turn. Sum it up, then multiply by {1 / (7 - N)}, where N is the number of people. So you really want full bursts to make that 50%. Then multiply again by elemental advantage or disadvantage if there is one. If it seems like it can be double dipping for advantage here, it is. And then multiply yet again for any burst streak buffs, but those come from eidolon passives that you wouldn't be using if you have other options.
So in practice, if your soul leads off the burst streak with elemental advantage, expect the burst streak itself to add ~72.5% damage on top of all of the individual bursts.