Thread: Consolidated Light Team Topic

Originally Posted by dreamlitz

Yes, my calculations implicitly assumes that everyone has the same base atk, which just isn't the case. However, when you start FLB-ing things, hime stats become a smaller and smaller portion of total atk, so those multipliers are gonna get closer together.

Good point; at enough attack you can start forgetting about what type of Himes you're fielding and focus more on what abilities they bring to the table.

Nitpick, but both Shingen and Michael AW ups DATA for the whole team. It's not on the same level as Tish and I won't rely on it for BG unless you stack it like crazy with eido effects, accessories and tiara bonuses (just gotta figure out how to survive those death beams from light rag...)

I didn't include it because the amounts, without other sources, are small absolute damage modifiers (less than 5-10%) and would muddy the analogy and equations. That said, they are absolutely important and are useful. I had a small scrap where I had written out the different DATA sources that I could possibly generate (Michael's, Thunderbird, Shingen's, Manag, etc.) and you should definitely take them into consideration as your buffing your team for 4T bursting.

I know people don't like Vishnu 'cos she's really hard to use, but she's fast, too, like Lugh fast, well until Lugh bursts that is... But Vishnu can actually keep herself alive. If you have no one better or don't have a healer to pair with Lugh, Vishnu still gets the job done. Also, if you're trying to MVP something and just need to burst as quickly as possible like the current raid, Metatron is your girl.

I apologize, I don't have Vishnu so I always forget how fast she is. As for Metatron, once she went into first sub spot, she also tends not to be on my thought list for team creation. She is fast, but doesn't support sustained fast bursting like the other 4 Himes we're talking about.

Do what I do - first TA buff from Tish goes on the soul, after the first burst, put it on Take. Keeps the burst speed pretty even so no one is falling significantly behind. That is why I love Tish, when you use her well, it keeps your burst machine in sync so it's rare for anyone to be waiting around for burst (unless you use Metatron, she's a different animal.)

So this isn't the correct burst order for your team. Let's talk fast team bursting. For Thunder Ult (where you absolutely have to burst on turn 3), your favored team is Shingen, Take/Art/Tsuki, Tishtrya, Sol, Michael. You want to use Trish's TA buff on the first Hime slot if it's not Take. If it's Take, you TA buff Sol. On turn 2 you use Michael's burst buff and Shingen's Encourage Inspiration buff so that you can then push the Thunder Ult into stun on turn 3 (3T burst). You can then move to a 4T burst cycle (burst on turn 4) for the rest of the combat as you get the free stun round and solo kill the Ult. Provisional Forest in used on the second full burst, if available and needed, but never on the first. For me it almost never gets activated as it slows the team down too much. You have Sol for when she tries to paralyze you and for some healing to keep you through the 20Mil life she has. This strategy also works on soloing the Wind Ult also (just no need for 3T burst). For the standard 4T burst cycle, I always buff the Hime prior (slot 1) to Tish (if not Take) so that I can get there and then buff Sol (slot 3) on the next opportunity. My current team is Shingen, Tsuki, Tish, Sol and Michael. I also activate both Michael and Shingen's DATA buff on turn one. It's fairly rare that Tsuki isn't at 90 for the 4T burst (less than ~5% of the time) and it's usually because I hit a streak of DA's instead of TA's. Takeminakata makes the team faster and hit harder, but I lose the full 50% DEF down in that setup, so I'm moving more to running Tsuki than Take at the moment. Make sure whoever you pick for the that second slot gets all DATA items you can give her. Right now Tsuki has, I think, around 7% total DATA from accessories since all three are just that. It's not enough, but it helps in sustaining the 4T burst on a slow Hime until we get the Tiara bonus unlocked.

If you're running Joan for sustain in a Rag fights, then, by all means, TA buff her. You're not trying to over power the Rag anymore and are looking to contribute through the fight.

Yes, but remember every time she gets her BG 20, she is also nuking for 3-3.5x, that's on top of her regular attack, so that's like much better than even Take's TA. Also, depending on whether you can spare Tish's heal on Lugh or have Sol on your team, Lugh can in theory keep it up much longer than Take. You can also 'store' Lugh's BG for 1T and do double nuke/BG the next turn, whereas Take's TA is wasted if you burst on a turn where her TA is still up (I want Lugh so badly )

Certainly not in the realm of Tish or Mike, yes, but they have different roles, and ideally you want all of them - Mike just speeds everyone up, Tish is fast and speeds up bottleneck himes, Lugh/Take/Vishnu are faster and makes it easy to accommodate a slow hime (Arty / LT / Sol / Eros / Raphy / whatever you have/need for the content you're facing.)

Don't worry bud... next Miracle Ticket! Won't be more than 3/4 months. Not that long at all.


Dejnov.

Originally Posted by Dejnov

So this isn't the correct burst order for your team. Let's talk fast team bursting. For Thunder Ult (where you absolutely have to burst on turn 3), your favored team is Shingen, Take/Art/Tsuki, Tishtrya, Sol, Michael. You want to use Trish's TA buff on the first Hime slot if it's not Take. If it's Take, you TA buff Sol. On turn 2 you use Michael's burst buff and Shingen's Encourage Inspiration buff so that you can then push the Thunder Ult into stun on turn 3 (3T burst). You can then move to a 4T burst cycle (burst on turn 4) for the rest of the combat as you get the free stun round and solo kill the Ult. Provisional Forest in used on the second full burst, if available and needed, but never on the first. For me it almost never gets activated as it slows the team down too much.

Sorry for another necro, but I'm still returning to this and especially position Mike should be on. Granted, I don't have Tish nor Shingen, so my burst aren't that fast, but still the general logic should be the same. So the question is - why is Mike on last spot, instead of first (outside of Take scenario)? While my initial thought was to indeed have Mike on last spot - so that the +20 BG from her burst doesn't get wasted, but giving it some second thought - in general it should not.

If Mike is on first Hime position, it allows you to FB when second hime is at 60%. This allows us to land a first FB faster. Now, if Mike is last, she instantly provides +20 to all characters for the next burst... But if she is in front of them, they don't need the immediate +20, as they will just get it during FB from Mike bursting before them. Finally, Mike also has a built-in double attack, which may sometimes save the FB, should the TA from Tish not proc...

One scenario where I could see the benefit of having her on last spot is if you are afraid she will die. That way, the +20 BG from her burst is already on other characters and will not be lost. It would also make more difference in some abstract scenario, where she would solo burst between FBs. At last spot she only needs 60%, she already gets 20% from her burst, maybe you also have some +BG abilities ready, so refilling for FB would not be out of question, but the odds are that by the time Mike is ready for her solo burst, some other hime is at 100% already, so you can't burst anyway.

So, TL;DR; - I see Michael on last spot in a lot of comments / screenshots. What am I missing here, that makes people chose this instead of placing her first?

Originally Posted by Crow

So, TL;DR; - I see Michael on last spot in a lot of comments / screenshots. What am I missing here, that makes people chose this instead of placing her first?

Nothing. None whatsoever.

There is nothing you need to worry about Mike's position other than her speed relative to the other members of your team. There had been this misconception (for god knows what reason) that Mike should be placed last so that the team may get a head start next cycle, but this is only half true, as people have forgotten that she also carries the speed of those placed behind her.

Nice. You've managed to figure out the best correct answer for your superstition *pachi pachi pachi*

what bear said is exactly what i do and i main light. i currently have michael as the first KH.
that being said, for certain quests, i go all-out offense and put in faster himes - ie. tish and take', in which case Michael takes a back seat.

Bumping this thread again. I wonder if any kind player could give us an update, on how is Light meta shaping with t4 souls on DMM? Are there any changes in himes we should be aiming for with rolls / tickets? Also, between Michael, Tish, Lugh, Iris, Vishnu, Sol and other utility himes, what is the go-to general purpose setup? With Lugh and Iris, it got a little bit crowded on the 'extremely strong and fast' himes market.

Originally Posted by Crow

how is Light meta shaping with t4 souls on DMM?

I don't have a DMM account, but my understanding is that the light meta won't change much since there're literally no new non-limited edition light SSRs released from now until about a year later when light Kingu comes out. The limited edition ones (Michiru, Halloween Hastur, Valentine's Baal) are not particularly remarkable (actually I like VBaal, but she doesn't do much that isn't already covered by some other light SSR, and she comes out after dark tower, so won't even be a useful tower body for a long while.)

The only big change is probably Eros AW early next year (supposed to be around February, but Azzy AW still isn't here, so who the heck knows...) she'll be part of the light meta for any fights where things keep throwing debuffs at you (i.e. almost every rag.)

As for T4 souls, well Medea is a top choice for competitive stuff regardless of element. After that, it's more playstyle. Hector seems popular, but if I'm not mistaken, her biggest selling point is the team-wide critical buff, which is great if you're fighting DRag/Aratron/Och, but if you're like me, where light is your one and only viable element, she won't be as attractive 'cos critical requires you to be on-element. If you're going Hector route, keep your Metatron hammer and Iris glaive dupes if you draw any - Meta hammer and Iris glaive both give 20BG refund on burst if you can FLB them, which will be very important for keeping Hector from slowing down your burst cycle too much. I'll probably go for Asclepius after Medea though, 'cos I like to AAB stuff - you need Sol and a good ascension grid if you're going that route.

I haven't researched much about the second batch of T4s, that's still too far away for me to pay attention so I won't comment much there. However, word is that Yori pretty much makes every element fast, so light will lose its edge in the age of Yori =(

Are there any changes in himes we should be aiming for with rolls / tickets? Also, between Michael, Tish, Lugh, Iris, Vishnu, Sol and other utility himes, what is the go-to general purpose setup? With Lugh and Iris, it got a little bit crowded on the 'extremely strong and fast' himes market.

Eros - most underrated light SSR imho. There is her eventual AW but she is still useful today though, especially if you aren't at the point where you can just wanpan everything. She has affliction block, which allows you to safely AAB things that are dangerous to not wanpan (e.g. TUlt and Sandalphon GO.) She is also a very good defense hime (I know she's classified as balanced, but she's more like a defense hime) - A frame 20% atk down and 1.2k barrier/def up on 3/6T CD - it may not seem like much but it adds up and synergizes well with Sol. She also works well with Hercules 'cos all her buffs make it pretty easy for Herc's nuke to hit cap. Oh, and she's very AAB-friendly, which is why Eros actually sees more use than Lugh for me, one can only manual so much for a day.

Also, with few exceptions, I'm of the opinion that pretty much every light SSR is useful, although in terms of mtix worthiness, I would probably only include Mike, Tish, Iris, Lugh, Sol, Eros (not necessarily in that order, depends on who else you have; full disclosure, I mtixed a bunch of himes not on that list due to a collector's impulse.) I won't actually include Vishnu even though she is very good; her weapon is worth the tix though if you're at the point of thinking of tix-ing primarily for weapons. The only himes that I don't see much use these days are light Tsuku (Iris just does everything better), Frey (don't have her on my main account yet, but if I did, I wouldn't use her outside of tower and maybe dummy - she's very good when you're nowhere near hitting burst cap but CD is too long and not fast enough to compete in a modern light team) and SSR Arty (Lugh/Iris does everything better, but she'll be usable again after rebalance, whenever that is.) None of those himes are bad btw, just less OP than others and don't have a niche that's hard to fill - they're still good if you don't have the more OP ones (heck, I practically grew up with light Tsuku, who helped me get to the point where I started challenging rags.)

Interesting, since Medea does not seem to have any BG generation. Does that mean that fast bursting (for example 3T cycle) is no longer played? But can she even burst on 5T cycle, without big help?