Thread: What the Future Holds: DMM Hime and Eidolons

if something works like vigor, then it should be easier to maintain than pride (especially in short fights). we don't have Vigor yet, but i can already tell it could possibly be worth it more than pride cause you want to end fights as fast as possible, and vigor greatly helps to that...

with vigor, we're talking 30% assault at the start of fights at lv20... and more when some stuff can go FLB... now imagine a grid full of vigor... you'll have at the very least 100% assault, but the start of the fight, 300%...

pride on the other hand benefits from longer fights, as it gets harder to maintain your HP as the fight goes on (unless you're super tanky like my wind team's def setup). with more trigger attacks appearing from bosses (and later on, regular/mid-boss enemies), it's just gonna become a downhill fight if you're just relying on just a healer and atk debuffs to keep you alive (maybe a tank can do it too). unless you can outheal the damage you take, that pride will eventually kick in, but as a reminder to quickly finish the fight before you start losing people.

granted, something that uses both can easily maintain a decent bonus, but far as I can tell.... Vigor > Pride.

either way, we kinda do need some eidolons (possibly hime cause some abilities like thor's self heal works like it) that work like vigor/pride cause they're likely to have some high level increases (100%+ for gacha ones, 50%+ for event ones). there are event ones that do it later on from what i can tell (i think Fluerty is one of them)

Originally Posted by Slashley

And Laventale closing the thread citing the Q&A thread in 3... 2... 1...

except this isn't a Q&A thing... this is discussing later hime and eidolons that come out... or their changes like summer sol's recent DMM buffs...

with vigor, we're talking 30% assault at the start of fights at lv20... and more when some stuff can go FLB... now imagine a grid full of vigor... you'll have at the very least 100% assault, but the start of the fight, 300%...

Either i misunderstood u completely, or u doesnt seem to know how vigor work

Originally Posted by Mirage

Either i misunderstood u completely, or u doesnt seem to know how vigor work

It was literally posted above him that vigor isnt assault but rather special attack

Originally Posted by MagicSpice

with vigor, we're talking 30% assault at the start of fights at lv20... and more when some stuff can go FLB... now imagine a grid full of vigor... you'll have at the very least 100% assault, but the start of the fight, 300%...

Here's something simple for you if shit GT is too hard for you
And another thing Vigor =/= Assault so Stahp comparing both

well since it's said that vigor isn't assault, but special attack... then doesn't that make it stronger than pride?

we're not talking an atk stat increase, but instead a raw damage one... which last i checked is more valuable... and if that's true, still does not change things when i said Vigor > Pride

plus i did also say that things related to current HP are still easier to maintain in fights depending on if it's shorter (more effect at higher HP), or longer (more effect at lower HP)... i think that still stands too

Originally Posted by MrSkd030

Here's something simple for you if shit GT is too hard for you
And another thing Vigor =/= Assault so Stahp comparing both

okay.... so are you done with the flaming BS now?

this is why i said before that people treating "misinformation" as a taboo needs to stop. it's really getting out of hand when people come at you this hard for a damn mistake and it's legit pissing me off

it's not that serious.... LET. IT. GO.

It's one thing to correct someone, but don't act like an asshole.

Originally Posted by MagicSpice

well since it's said that vigor isn't assault, but special attack... then doesn't that make it stronger than pride?--

I don't think there is a "universally correct" answer here.

Pride: Always works, even better when at low HP
Vigor: Ridiculously powerful at high HP, but you gain zero if you drop to 50% or below

So, which one is better will depend on content and your team. Most of the time Vigor will be better, but if there was an Amaru that takes 10 turns to kill, then you wouldn't want to bring Vigor for example.

Originally Posted by Slashley

I don't think there is a "universally correct" answer here.

Pride: Always works, even better when at low HP
Vigor: Ridiculously powerful at high HP, but you gain zero if you drop to 50% or below

So, which one is better will depend on content and your team. Most of the time Vigor will be better, but if there was an Amaru that takes 10 turns to kill, then you wouldn't want to bring Vigor for example.

which still goes back to vigor being better at faster fights.... as in fights (even boss ones) you can deal with in a few turns.

hence why i said pride is more suited to longer fights cause there's more chances you'll take damage or be at lower HP values

If you're clearing say, a ragnarok advent battle in 4~5 turns, you're likely going to still be clearing it in 4~5 turns, switching a pride to a vigor. You might see better damage numbers but when it comes to a battle that is already quick to clear, they aren't exactly better, rather they make little difference because you're still clearing within the same speed. Of course, there are several other variables to factor in too but if you want to see them being better, you want lengthy battles in which you can sustain your HP at high values throughout the fight.

Originally Posted by Aidoru

If you're clearing say, a ragnarok advent battle in 4~5 turns, you're likely going to still be clearing it in 4~5 turns, switching a pride to a vigor. You might see better damage numbers but when it comes to a battle that is already quick to clear, they aren't exactly better, rather they make little difference because you're still clearing within the same speed. Of course, there are several other variables to factor in too but if you want to see them being better, you want lengthy battles in which you can sustain your HP at high values throughout the fight.

but the way both of those weapon skills works is more damage output (in different ways) based on current HP.

not only does vigor use a better modifier for damage output, but pride also needs your HP lowered... meaning you have to spend a few turns taking damage for it to build up. opposed to vigor where you get best potential at the start. sure it drops as you take damage, but how much of your team is getting hit for that to be an issue?

i'm pretty sure vigor's damage increase boosting you at the start is gonna cut off a turn or two, making a 4-5 turn run become 3-4. or are you saying you'll get your HP lowered to 5% or less by the end of the fight to get the most out of pride, when you can just maintain it for a high vigor effect? cause staying above 60% hp on everyone in a short fight isn't hard unless you're just not paying attention. and if you got a buff/damage heavy team anyway, vigor is just gonna capitalize more

for example, my buff heavy fire team could rack up 70k-80k per normal hit with full HP (and of course belial, but that's beside the point). and this means pride isn't giving any bonus effect. vigor should be spiking that damage higher at the start (probably around 100k). Assuming it is giving a 20-30% damage increase, that's pretty much 70k-80k per hit now becoming 84k-104k per hit. that racks up.... more so given when DA/TA goes off.

so assuming you (somehow) get all 5 to do TA, that's 252k-312k per person or roughly 1mil-1.6mil damage that round. even then, if vigor is giving even 10%, that's still worth one extra hit out of every 10... it still racks up, but not as fast.

i'm pretty sure something like this is saving you a turn or more, compared to trying to build up pride's effect