Thread: Kamihime General Discussion + Q&A

Originally Posted by Slashley

That's not how it works as far as I can tell.

Everyone: ~2% chance of getting a Phantom weapon
Everyone: ~50% chance of getting a Magna
Vice MvP: ~10% chance of getting a Magna (basically worth absolutely nothing)
MvP: 100% Magna
Host: x% Magna (high, but pretty sure it's not every time) and 2x Fragments

So, all that you get from being a MvP is tripling your Magna income (50% -> 150%). But that's when you spend like 10x more effort into the raid, maybe even 20x. So why bother? Just hit the boss once and leave. Go to another Rag and hit it once and leave. Go to another Rag and just AAB (since the maximum raids you can be at the same time is 3). And oh look, you got the same amount of Magnas and 3x chances of Phantom weapons for effectively zero effort. The only argument that can be made is for Seed usage.

Manualing raids for MvP is a waste of your time, especially if some whale shows up and just annihilates the effort you put in (since Vice has effectively zero awards). Designing content which isn't meant to be soloed, then only give an extra reward to one person out of 10-20 is completely insane. It could be fine if all you needed was like... 100 Magnas, but you need 240 as a starting point. And this is before counting other Magna uses such as future Olympia raid hosting.

The whole system is a complete failure, really.

Wow i allways though the 2% null is for each plat chest. You get the infor from DMM wiki or any trustworthy source ?

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Wow i allways though the 2% null is for each plat chest. You get the infor from DMM wiki or any trustworthy source ?

My limited experience combined with the limited experience of some other Nutaku players. Those numbers are rough, I haven't kept a tally or anything.

And remember that RNG is going to RNG. For most people who don't MvP, the amount of Phantom weapons tends to be around the same amount as the SSR Hime they've unlocked slots for. Personally, I've unlocked 4+4 and I have 9 Phantom drops. Meanwhile, there's one person with like 3+3 unlocks... and one Phantom drop... yikes.

Originally Posted by Slashley

And remember that RNG is going to RNG. For most people who don't MvP, the amount of Phantom weapons tends to be around the same amount as the SSR Hime they've unlocked slots for.

Wait, you have to MVP to have trigger the 2% chance? And does being the 'discoverer' count?

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Wait, you have to MVP to have trigger the 2% chance? And does being the 'discoverer' count?

No, as I said previously, if you MvP, then you effectively triple your Magna droprate. That means that if you literally MvP EVERY time, you'll have 3x SSR Hime unlocked per each Phantom weapon.

As far as I can tell, the Phantom weapon droprate is either 2% for all, or maybe 0.2% per weapon (so technically you can get all nine weapons in a single raid - unknown). Whether you host, MvP or Vice has nothing to do with the Phantom droprate. As far as I can tell, anyway.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Null weapon

Originally Posted by Slashley

Null weapon

Originally Posted by Many Others

snip & snip

Okay... there are quite a number of details that I wanna nitpick on but lemme first help you with what you maybe desperate to know: The Lv90 Raids' drop table.

This is base off what I've gathered and with help from both the English discord community for taco side, the Chinese player community and from twitterfeeds by Japanese players for DMM side. Forget the DMM wiki chart. I've already seen too many rare but legit cases that don't fully match the drop table described by the wiki. Anyway here goes:

First you need to know that there are 3 types of chests:
- Chest that only drops Magna
- Chest that drops both Magna and Weapon (Rare)
- a Rare Chest that drops only Weapon

Drop distrubution, ignoring the other not important drops:

All Partiticipants - 0~1 Magna chest + 0~1 Rare Weapon Chest
Host - 1 Magna chest + 0~1 Magna chest
MVP - 1 Magna/Weapon chest + 0~1 Magna/Weapon chest
Vice - 0~1 Magna chest

This means the following things:
- The max number of magna you can get in 1 raid is 5, by being Host + MVP
- The max number of null you can get in 1 raid is 3, by being MVP (w/o the need of being the host)
- The theoratical 'best case' scenario would be 3 magna + 3 weapons, at an astronomic chance.
- Hosting only gives you more chances at magna, not weapon.
- MVP gets 2 extra shots at weapon drop.
- The drops you can get as Vice ranges from 2 magna + 1 weapon to absolutely nothing.
- The max number of magna you can get as leech is 1. If you see 2 chest drops, congratulations you got yourself a weapon.


The drop %. You can just more or less forget about trying to figure out an accurate number given the way drops are distributed. We can't even figure out the question of whether the chance of Magna/Weapon chest dropping a weapon is the same as the Rare Weapon chest itself dropping. Just keep grinding and hope for the best, and 1 year from now (if taco is still alive that is) you will be able to buy the weapons (of your choice) off the new 'Raid Medal' shop.


..... Annnd ninja'd by nut

Originally Posted by Bear

Okay... there are quite a number of details that I wanna nitpick on but lemme first help you with what you maybe desperate to know: The Lv90 Raids' drop table.

This is base off what I've gathered and with help from both the English discord community for taco side, the Chinese player community and from twitterfeeds by Japanese players for DMM side. Forget the DMM wiki chart. I've already seen too many rare but legit cases that don't fully match the drop table described by the wiki. Anyway here goes:

First you need to know that there are 3 types of chests:
- Chest that only drops Magna
- Chest that drops both Magna and Weapon (Rare)
- a Rare Chest that drops only Weapon

Drop distrubution, ignoring the other not important drops:

All Partiticipants - 0~1 Magna chest + 0~1 Rare Weapon Chest
Host - 1 Magna chest + 0~1 Magna chest
MVP - 1 Magna/Weapon chest + 0~1 Magna/Weapon chest
Vice - 0~1 Magna chest

This means the following things:
- The max number of magna you can get in 1 raid is 5, by being Host + MVP
- The max number of null you can get in 1 raid is 3, by being MVP (w/o the need of being the host)
- The theoratical 'best case' scenario would be 3 magna + 3 weapons, at an astronomic chance.
- Hosting only gives you more chances at magna, not weapon.
- MVP gets 2 extra shots at weapon drop.
- The drops you can get as Vice ranges from 2 magna + 1 weapon to absolutely nothing.
- The max number of magna you can get as leech is 1. If you see 2 chest drops, congratulations you got yourself a weapon.


The drop %. You can just more or less forget about trying to figure out an accurate number given the way drops are distributed. We can't even figure out the question of whether the chance of Magna/Weapon chest dropping a weapon is the same as the Rare Weapon chest itself dropping. Just keep grinding and hope for the best, and 1 year from now (if taco is still alive that is) you will be able to buy the weapons (of your choice) off the new 'Raid Medal' shop.


..... Annnd ninja'd by nut

Ahihi, I happen to see your post in discord some days ago.

All of my drop fall into it but, I have seen some screenshot of 2 phantom, but is there any of 3 phantom drop?

Originally Posted by Bear

--
Drop distrubution, ignoring the other not important drops:

All Partiticipants - 0~1 Magna chest + 0~1 Rare Weapon Chest
Host - 1 Magna chest + 0~1 Magna chest
MVP - 1 Magna/Weapon chest + 0~1 Magna/Weapon chest
Vice - 0~1 Magna chest
--

The problem with this is, it doesn't even try to give SOME kind of referendum to what 0~1 means. For example, looking at this, it looks like Vice could be worth your time, which it is not. It is far more useful to give a rough idea on the droprates, such as ~10% on Vice and ~50% for all.

The interesting thing here is that MvP supposedly gets a second chance at Phantom weapons, but the rate seems really low.

Originally Posted by Slashley

The problem with this is, it doesn't even try to give SOME kind of referendum to what 0~1 means. For example, looking at this, it looks like Vice could be worth your time, which it is not. It is far more useful to give a rough idea on the droprates, such as ~10% on Vice and ~50% for all.

The interesting thing here is that MvP supposedly gets a second chance at Phantom weapons, but the rate seems really low.

> Vice worthing your time
No, it isn't. I don't know why you'd think that list conveys that, cuz 0~1 pretty much means you have a significant chance to get absolutely nothing. You don't even need a hard number to figure that out. If you don't have what it takes to be MVP, there is zero incentive to care about vice at all. It's all or nothing. More so if you care only about the weapon drop.

> Weapon drop rate seems really low
I think I've already listed that the occasion of weapon dropping at all, be it from the magna/weapon chest or from the rare weapon chest itself, is rare. I haven't been getting any null drops for the past month and a half myself, if this makes you feel any better.

Originally Posted by nut

Ahihi, I happen to see your post in discord some days ago.

All of my drop fall into it but, I have seen some screenshot of 2 phantom, but is there any of 3 phantom drop?

^ Not my screenshot. I know my place on the pyramid of luck.
^ Also, according to the tweet, that's from non-host MVP

Yes, but:

Originally Posted by Bear

-- I already pointed out the general consensus of a very high majority of the players: Vice reward is shit. Illogically and irritably horse shit. You lose the MVP race, to the game's eyes you're no different than a leech, and you get treated almost the same as one. That's it.--

This is the part which is NOT obvious from the way you represented the drops.

With information like that, a newer player may think that it's a great idea to aim for Vice, until they experience the horrible reality first hand. I don't think that's a good thing. In other words, this:

Originally Posted by Bear

--
Drop distrubution, ignoring the other not important drops:

All Partiticipants - 0~1 Magna chest + 0~1 Rare Weapon Chest
Host - 1 Magna chest + 0~1 Magna chest
MVP - 1 Magna/Weapon chest + 0~1 Magna/Weapon chest
Vice - fucking nothing
--

Would be okay. Not something I'd use myself as it gives no description as to how likely the three different 0~1 that are left are, but it's okay.

That's the biggest beef I have with representing the drops like that. It NEEDS to show that Vice is effectively worthless.

I agree. Even if you don't want to put hard number, saying "very low chance" "average chance" "high chance" at least give an indication. The way you present it, Vice MVP double your magna income compared to simply hit once and leave to do another.

If you say "very low chance of magna" for vice mvp and "average chance of magna" for all participants, it doesn't convey this false impression, and a reader readily understand that vice mvp is really bad.