Thread: Accessory Quests

Personally I find it hard to rate ones above the other, because they are all situational on the girls. So I just have ones I consider Useful and ones that aren't.

Useful - Atk, Def, Affliction Resist Down (I only use with my Debuffers), Ability Damage (Most useful on girls that have multi-hit Abilities, like Susanoo, Azazel, Ares, etc)

Ok - HP, Drop Rate (I'm a Snatch and drop rate believer), Burst Damage (For Burst Specialists like Uriel)

Fodderable - Mode Gauge Reduction, Atk Rate, Affliction Resist Up

Originally Posted by SlickFenix

Burst Damage (For Burst Specialists like Uriel)

Burst on accesories is trash cause it adds to the burst multiplier, not to your final burst dmg, and Uriel doesnt need burst accesories to hit cap anyways.

Originally Posted by SlickFenix

--
Useful - -- Ability Damage (Most useful on girls that have multi-hit Abilities, like Susanoo, Azazel, Ares, etc)
--

More like entirely useless on everyone that doesn't have multi-hit Abilities. Even then, you should be considering "is this better than Atk?"

Because Atk will give 3% Assault to everything (Abilities, auto-attacks AND bursts), whileas Ability will give +0.05 modifier to one Ability which has a cooldown AND a damage cap.

Like, Awakened Susanoo first Ability hits a whopping eight times, so damage increase from Ability+ is from 8*0.9 = 7.2 to 8*(0.9+0.05) = 7.6. Cooldown of 5 turns. In 5 turns Awakened Susanoo will hit 6 times (average), so total hit output goes from 13.2 to 13.6 - a 3% damage increase. Is that more than 3% Assault? Probably. You already have a fuckload of Assault from your Grid, so Atk+ is absolutely not 3% more damage (probably closer to 1.5% or even 1%). But we still have to remember that Ability+ doesn't do anything for your bursts, and that this is still assuming that you're not hitting damage cap, which is 88k per hit for Susanoo. Obviously, if you're at the damage cap, then Ability+ will do absolutely nothing for you. Oh, and as a sidenote, I've disregarded Susanoo's third Ability to keep this simpler.

The point is, if Susanoo with her 8 hits is a "probably good" then how good is Ability+ for others? In general, absolute trash. It's the kind of a stat that if you get a Atk+/Ability+ SR or SSR, then you slap it on Ares/Susanoo/Azazel/Brahma, but otherwise, it's just rubbish. Like a SR with Ability+/Gauge is likely to lose to your basic, cheap-as-fuck Atk+ R even for multi-hitters. And once you get better Accessories? You cannot even recycle that Ability+ Accessory due to it being just a complete waste of space for others.

Originally Posted by Slashley

More like entirely useless on everyone that doesn't have multi-hit Abilities. Even then, you should be considering "is this better than Atk?"

Because Atk will give 3% Assault to everything (Abilities, auto-attacks AND bursts), whileas Ability will give +0.05 modifier to one Ability which has a cooldown AND a damage cap.

Like, Awakened Susanoo first Ability hits a whopping eight times, so damage increase from Ability+ is from 8*0.9 = 7.2 to 8*(0.9+0.05) = 7.6. Cooldown of 5 turns. In 5 turns Awakened Susanoo will hit 6 times (average), so total hit output goes from 13.2 to 13.6 - a 3% damage increase. Is that more than 3% Assault? Probably. You already have a fuckload of Assault from your Grid, so Atk+ is absolutely not 3% more damage (probably closer to 1.5% or even 1%). But we still have to remember that Ability+ doesn't do anything for your bursts, and that this is still assuming that you're not hitting damage cap, which is 88k per hit for Susanoo. Obviously, if you're at the damage cap, then Ability+ will do absolutely nothing for you. Oh, and as a sidenote, I've disregarded Susanoo's third Ability to keep this simpler.

The point is, if Susanoo with her 8 hits is a "probably good" then how good is Ability+ for others? In general, absolute trash. It's the kind of a stat that if you get a Atk+/Ability+ SR or SSR, then you slap it on Ares/Susanoo/Azazel/Brahma, but otherwise, it's just rubbish. Like a SR with Ability+/Gauge is likely to lose to your basic, cheap-as-fuck Atk+ R even for multi-hitters. And once you get better Accessories? You cannot even recycle that Ability+ Accessory due to it being just a complete waste of space for others.

I never said it was better than attack, I only said that it was most useful on Kami with Multi-hit abilities. That is where you will see it give most. Still the sucky thing about it is that it only applies to abilities so that it is only used after abilities are CD. Ideally I would prefer to run Atk on everyone that I can, but those don't drop very often, at least not for me. So I gotta make use of what I got and since ability damage has a greater affect on those girls with multi-hit abilities I'll use it there first until I have enough Atk to give to everyone.

Originally Posted by SlickFenix

-- That is where you will see it give most. --

See, this is the part why I made the post entirely. It's not "the most," it is "only" or "exclusively"
Because there is a big fat line there and it looks to me like you're on the wrong side!

Originally Posted by Slashley

See, this is the part why I made the post entirely. It's not "the most," it is "only" or "exclusively"
Because there is a big fat line there and it looks to me like you're on the wrong side!

No, the most because it will still give bonus to any other damage dealing ability, but you will see the greatest effect for that bonus on Kami that have multi-hit abilities like the ones that I stated. You even said so in your previous post that the ability increase damage has it's greatest effect on multi-hit ability girls, but it's still not better than Atk effect.

Did I say that my post was the absolute most correct thing ever? No, I said that it was my opinion on what I like to use and how I saw things. Granted, I should have put the Ability on the OK line instead of useful, because it is OK to use it if it's all you have, just like any other accessory. When optimizing to get the best, then all you really want is Atk, Def, and Debuff resist down (on the Kami that have Debuffs). The reality is, that those don't drop all the time and I don't have crazy good Accessory luck like Kitty does. So, I have to prioritize where I put what I have. So, I use the ability damage on those Kami and the Atk ones on Kami that don't have that. Once I have excess Atk effect accessories, then sure I will swap out the Ability Damage ones on those Kami. Right now, I don't.

Now, how about you stop shoving your High and Mighty, my way is the best way, Shit attitude down peoples throat with that "You're on the Wrong side of the line" shit. We are all going to play this game how we damn well want to. When you start throwing that shit around people are going to naturally get defensive and resist anything you tell them.

Nowhere did I say that my way is the best or the optimal, just that here is how I see things. The point of my first post above was that people are comparing effects of accessories saying that This is greater than that which is greater than that, etc and that I don't believe that it is that linear, because best effects depend on the girl you use them on. Like Debuff resist down is only effective when used on Debuffers, Ability Damage is at it's most effective on Multi-hit (I did not say it's the best effect), Atk and Def are Universal, as well as HP.

Originally Posted by SlickFenix

No, the most because it will still give bonus to any other damage dealing ability, but you will see the greatest effect for that bonus on Kami that have multi-hit abilities like the ones that I stated.
-- Ability Damage is at it's most effective on Multi-hit (I did not say it's the best effect), --

See, this is again where I get high and mighty. Since I still don't think you've quite grasped the idea. Maybe that's just me being really bad at expressing it... anyway, you're using the word "most" effective here. It's not "most", it's "only"

Let's take another example. Nemesis. Nemesis has TWO damaging Abilities. One that hits for 3.5x damage (six turns) and one that hits for 4x damage (eight turns). So that's from 3.5/6 = 0.58 damage per turn to 3.55/6 = 0.59 per turn, and from 4/8 = 0.5 to 4.05/8 = 0.51 per turn. So... Nemesis goes from 1+0.58+0.5 = 2.08 to 1+0.59+0.51 = 2.1. That's a... 1.007 increase (when not using rounding, numbers written down here are with rounding). So 0.7% increase. And mind you - this is NEMESIS who has TWO damage Abilities and we're not factoring in bursts or damage caps in yet. Hime who have ONE damaging Ability can expect a whopping 0.35% damage increase from Ability+. Suddenly, Gauge- sounds like a lot better option than Ability+, no?

tl;dr; FORGET Ability+. It has "okay" status on a couple of extremely specific SSR Hime only (note: not any SRs due to extremely low damage caps). So saying that it's "most effective" is just outright wrong - Ability+ is entirely useless for anyone who isn't exactly Ares/Susanoo/Azazel/Brahma/SSR Artemis/Arianrhod. Seriously, use the relatively abundant and extremely cheap Atk+ R Accessories over Ability+.


Also, if you want me to be high and mighty, I'd like to point out that HP+ is going to diminish in value soon. As we'll soon start getting FLBs, Assault/HP weapons will become more and more common throughout the elements and we'll start hitting 12k+ HP with relative ease. When that happens, a few % of base HP isn't going to mean much. Meanwhile, Def+ will continue to give more and more EHP (Effective HP). As such, you should probably lower HP+ along with Ability+ into the "fodderable" section if we're thinking six months or more into the future.

And finally, Dbl+ actually scales with your damage output, which means that... it isn't all that bad. Really, the only reason it's not in "useful" section is because it doesn't directly benefit your bursts.

Originally Posted by Slashley

See, this is again where I get high and mighty. Since I still don't think you've quite grasped the idea. Maybe that's just me being really bad at expressing it... anyway, you're using the word "most" effective here. It's not "most", it's "only"

Let's take another example. Nemesis. Nemesis has TWO damaging Abilities. One that hits for 3.5x damage (six turns) and one that hits for 4x damage (eight turns). So that's from 3.5/6 = 0.58 damage per turn to 3.55/6 = 0.59 per turn, and from 4/8 = 0.5 to 4.05/8 = 0.51 per turn. So... Nemesis goes from 1+0.58+0.5 = 2.08 to 1+0.59+0.51 = 2.1. That's a... 1.007 increase (when not using rounding, numbers written down here are with rounding). So 0.7% increase. And mind you - this is NEMESIS who has TWO damage Abilities and we're not factoring in bursts or damage caps in yet. Hime who have ONE damaging Ability can expect a whopping 0.35% damage increase from Ability+. Suddenly, Gauge- sounds like a lot better option than Ability+, no?

tl;dr; FORGET Ability+. It has "okay" status on a couple of extremely specific SSR Hime only (note: not any SRs due to extremely low damage caps). So saying that it's "most effective" is just outright wrong - Ability+ is entirely useless for anyone who isn't exactly Ares/Susanoo/Azazel/Brahma/SSR Artemis/Arianrhod. Seriously, use the relatively abundant and extremely cheap Atk+ R Accessories over Ability+.


Also, if you want me to be high and mighty, I'd like to point out that HP+ is going to diminish in value soon. As we'll soon start getting FLBs, Assault/HP weapons will become more and more common throughout the elements and we'll start hitting 12k+ HP with relative ease. When that happens, a few % of base HP isn't going to mean much. Meanwhile, Def+ will continue to give more and more EHP (Effective HP). As such, you should probably lower HP+ along with Ability+ into the "fodderable" section if we're thinking six months or more into the future.

And finally, Dbl+ actually scales with your damage output, which means that... it isn't all that bad. Really, the only reason it's not in "useful" section is because it doesn't directly benefit your bursts.

I don't think we're understanding each other here. I'm not arguing your numbers. I am merely saying that the Ability Damage increase effect is at its most effective (meaning having the most effect for what it gives) on Multi-hit ability Kami.

I think you are somehow getting confused by that and thinking that I am saying that Ability Damage Increase is a great effect, or is the most effective. Which is not at all what I am saying.

Just to be clear (hopefully), if all you have is Ability Damage Up then it is best used with a Multi-hit ability Kami. That is where you will see the most gain from that effect. However, overall Atk Increase is better to have since it affects every aspect of dealing damage.

Oh shit, you can now spy on people's Accessories.

After going through Drama Club members, Ixion members, and people from my Friend List, people seem to generally fall into these categories:
1. Zero shits given, maybe some level 1 Accessories.
2. Some shits given, maybe a couple of leveled up Accessories here and there.
3. Accessories are there only for stats, every slot filled with whatever the fuck random SSRs and leveled, even for pure debuffers.
4. All Hime have their Accessory slots filled and leveled, given appropriate accessories depending on their role.
5. All Hime have their Accessory slots filled and leveled, and Def+ goes into every slot. EVERY. SLOT.

It's really surprising just how many people even at the "top" fall into categories #1 or #2. Maybe like 60%? The rest go fairly evenly across #3-5. Of course, since I can only spy on one element, it's fully possible that people just had a "bad" element up and thus didn't have shit there. Like for me, my Light and Dark teams just have fuck-all.

I'd fall into category #4, but I can't help but to wonder if #5 would actually be the correct way. There are plenty of ways to get base stats, so #3 seems like a terrible solution. #4 is great for debuffers, but what do my Atk+ Accessories really do? My Grid mostly takes care of Assault and that will only continue to grow with the introduction of FLBs, diminishing the value of Accessory Atk+ even further.

Meanwhile, Def+ will only continue to get stronger as the HP pool will continue to grow and grow... and will not diminish as there's nothing that will increase base Def. DMM has started to introduce Elem+ Def+ Eidolons, but for some reason, those seem to be a complete joke when compared to Elem+ Counter-element res+ Eidolons. 30% Elem+ with 15% Def+ (equals 7.5% less damage taken) when compared to 40% Elem+ with -10% Elem res+ (equals 10% less damage taken)... seriously, DMM? Am I missing something?

So anyway. I wonder if I should start swapping to Def+ Accessories on non-debuffers...?

No. The acc been shifting to tiaras with preferably DA and/or TA due to burst meta and the broken af bonus from tiara set effect. Def is still nice to have but ppl don't value it as much as they used to.

Priorities:
- Get 3 tiaras per hime
- Alternatively, 3 necklace instead if hime doesn't need help with speed. Or 3 earrings for very specific himes.
- DA or TA. Debuff rate for specific debuffers only
- Atk / Def up. Healing up for very specific himes
- w/e else