Thread: [Event 69] Advent Battle vs Rahab (Rematch)

Vicious Ocean Tide Spear is comically bad compared to the other Event SSR Water weapons of very recent times (Water Sickle of Guilty Sloth, Lazy Bow Hail Punisher, and Rahab's Knife). Not only is the Spear incapable of being Full Limit Broken where the three aforementioned all can be, but its Assault is downgraded for Stinger which is pretty terrible Skill given that it requires both favourable element (which is the last element you'll need more damage against given that you already hit their weak point) and involves rolls for random spike damage rather than a steady reliable increase.
Against everything that isn't Fire, it has the same Weapon Skill as an SR except it demands way more fodder to increase. On top of all this, it inexplicably punishes you for using it as a Soul Weapon by hitting you with multiple debuffs upon Bursting.

I picked it up anyway because I'm new and still have some Level 85 SRs/Level 50 SSRs I can't break further that I need to replace, and the 40 extra Levels should be more than sufficient to offset the extra tedium of levelling its Blizzard Assault.

It's also a viable weapon to stuff in the grid just in case you pick up a phantom spear and you want to use it for your water team. Granted, that in itself is a stretch between the odds of picking up a phantom weapon and how few SSR water spears there are.

The weapon skill effect page putting crits in the same multiplier as berserk's pretty old. Like I remember that being the understanding last year.
Going through the history for the damage calculation page, it's the June 13 edit this year that put crits into their own multiplier. For that matter, the July 28 edit starts separating vigor from special (but still labeled both as special). The August 20 edit fully separates vigor from special.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

It's also a viable weapon to stuff in the grid just in case you pick up a phantom spear and you want to use it for your water team. Granted, that in itself is a stretch between the odds of picking up a phantom weapon and how few SSR water spears there are.

The weapon skill effect page putting crits in the same multiplier as berserk's pretty old. Like I remember that being the understanding last year.
Going through the history for the damage calculation page, it's the June 13 edit this year that put crits into their own multiplier. For that matter, the July 28 edit starts separating vigor from special (but still labeled both as special). The August 20 edit fully separates vigor from special.

Crits being a RNG spike damage option gets nerfed in the future, however.

Instead of the crit being rolled once and applying for all hits of a move, each hit of the move gets rolled separately. To make things worse, this includes the multi hits of burst.

Originally Posted by Cobblemaniac

Crits being a RNG spike damage option gets nerfed in the future, however.

Instead of the crit being rolled once and applying for all hits of a move, each hit of the move gets rolled separately. To make things worse, this includes the multi hits of burst.

Everyone refers to this as a nerf. Is it? It looks more like the same overall damage, spread more consistently.

Originally Posted by Dunhere

Everyone refers to this as a nerf. Is it? It looks more like the same overall damage, spread more consistently.

On crit buffs, yes considering crit buffs are limited in time, so this pretty much skews the maths more towards nerf since you don't actually have infinite samples to work with, and tons more variability.

Spreading consistently is a thing that applies to stinger, and even then, stinger's not exactly the first weapon skill that comes to your mind when you think a good grid.

Originally Posted by Cobblemaniac

On crit buffs, yes considering crit buffs are limited in time, so this pretty much skews the maths more towards nerf since you don't actually have infinite samples to work with, and tons more variability.

Spreading consistently is a thing that applies to stinger, and even then, stinger's not exactly the first weapon skill that comes to your mind when you think a good grid.

While I agree that it's nerf for crit being RNG spike damage, in overall I like new way of it working more. It actually reduces variance in damage.

Originally Posted by Gludateton

While I agree that it's nerf for crit being RNG spike damage, in overall I like new way of it working more. It actually reduces variance in damage.

With a 20% boost to damage and a ~10% chance of occurring (at slvl 20) that's approximately a 2% boost to overall damage (now that it can occur on every attack) and can be considered fairly reliable. From what someone mentioned earlier it occurs in a different frame than assault damage which means that the 2% is similar in power to a 3% increase in assault.

That makes the Spear similar to an Assault (L) weapon from the current assault (M). Not terribly bad for an SSR I think.


Dejnov.

Originally Posted by Dejnov

which means that the 2% is similar in power to a 3% increase in assault.

That's some rather weak weapon grid. 2% is 3% assault with 50% assault already present, 4% with 100%, 5% with 150% and so on. Point still stands, with rolling it on every attack/burst hit it's more reliable.

Originally Posted by Gludateton

That's some rather weak weapon grid. 2% is 3% assault with 50% assault already present, 4% with 100%, 5% with 150% and so on. Point still stands, with rolling it on every attack/burst hit it's more reliable.

I like it cause i always roll with ele adv, i work on all my teams, but keep that in mind always, its ele adv dependant, so its not a good skill obv for people who tends to how to say it, "overuse" their main.

Originally Posted by Dejnov

With a 20% boost to damage and a ~10% chance of occurring (at slvl 20) that's approximately a 2% boost to overall damage (now that it can occur on every attack) and can be considered fairly reliable. From what someone mentioned earlier it occurs in a different frame than assault damage which means that the 2% is similar in power to a 3% increase in assault.

That makes the Spear similar to an Assault (L) weapon from the current assault (M). Not terribly bad for an SSR I think.


Dejnov.

The thing with probability is...

It's that. Probability. The numbers you see as an average is represents not what will actually happen, but what may happen. The probability will probably only truly reflect the actual thing given an infinite amount of samples, but there's no such thing as an infinite number of turns in this game. What you're left with is a setup that sometimes works super well in your favour, and sometimes not, and sometimes completely cucks you. In that case, I'd rather have weapon effects such as vigor that also happen to fall on a different frame for calculation that doesn't fall solely on invisible RNG.

That said, assault still king, so this kind of debate is really peripheral.