Thread: New DMM Feature: Seraph Union Events! (Goodbye Demon)

Originally Posted by Slashley

Uuuh. I really doubt that.

Single skill FLB = 15% + base (9% in this case)
Double skill FLB = 15% + 15% + base (usually 3% in event weapons)
Now, for example Crit has only 0.2 value, so it's like 15% + 3% + 3%.

... okay fine, it's not worthless (the Assault weapon that is) but it sure isn't impressive. Assault's value can easily be halved, so it's like... 12% vs. 12%, with the Crit pulling ahead on Grids above 100% Assault (read: all of them) but only with elemental advantage.

I think he meant non-FLB dual skill weapons.

awesome thing about the new UE seraph girls is that theres no more of that bullshit fucking rage/stun/rage/stun spam, since her normal mode takes quite a while to get to even rage. gives those who wanna manual a chance to use their rage nukes and stun bursts if need be.
same on both expert and ult.

that much dmg so far and only built up not even half of her mode gauge bar kek

Her normal Mode Gauge is approx. 12m damage long. Couldnt properly test how much is needed to get her into stun though, but it aint fast either.

That actually makes stun punishers worse (back to being the trash they normally are outside of UE); they're terrible because of how relatively late into a fight does stun mode usually show up. A short mode gauge means that the opportunity for a stun punisher to be remotely relevant comes up earlier and more often.
If normal mode lasts 10-12 million HP, then raging mode itself won't show up until the 30's (exactly lv 30 if it's a 10 million normal mode bar), without using something like Acala's normal gauge pusher against wind. Assuming rage itselfs lasts for as long as normal, that's another 30+ levels on top of that before stun shows up for the first time, without using any % rage gauge shavers (although those would now be worth potentially millions of HP now if you want to get out of rage asap). And our experience has almost always been that rage lasts noticably longer than normal mode.

Thing is, there's not a lot of depth to Nutaku unions. For ult, a high of ~104-108 gets you to rank in the 90's, ~115-118 gets you to rank in the 80's. For unions in that range, you'll probably only see stun mode show up once, pretty late into the fight, and only if your union's pushing. Otherwise, on non-push days, you probably won't see stun mode.

For expert... how long does the normal mode last? Cause the wiki lists 6 million for raging, but doesn't say for normal. Conversely, I see lv 30 as the minimum for ult to see rage, implying a 10 million HP normal mode, but no numbers for raging.
Anyway, 6 million HP for raging means that a single rage bar lasts 40 levels on its own (as expert's HP is 500k base + 150k per level). So the duration before each instance of stun mode is (however many levels worth of HP normal mode is) + ~40 levels worth of HP for raging. Stun mode would just show up far less frequently compared to the seven sins' "all the damn time".

For rage punishing stuff? *shrug* For them, the times where they're applicable get smushed together from small frequent slices into big chunks like in most non-UE content. And they're still relevant outside of UE, so they're not worried.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

That actually makes stun punishers worse (back to being the trash they normally are outside of UE); they're terrible because of how relatively late into a fight does stun mode usually show up. A short mode gauge means that the opportunity for a stun punisher to be remotely relevant comes up earlier and more often.
If normal mode lasts 10-12 million HP, then raging mode itself won't show up until the 30's (exactly lv 30 if it's a 10 million normal mode bar), without using something like Acala's normal gauge pusher against wind. Assuming rage itselfs lasts for as long as normal, that's another 30+ levels on top of that before stun shows up for the first time, without using any % rage gauge shavers (although those would now be worth potentially millions of HP now if you want to get out of rage asap). And our experience has almost always been that rage lasts noticably longer than normal mode.

Thing is, there's not a lot of depth to Nutaku unions. For ult, a high of ~104-108 gets you to rank in the 90's, ~115-118 gets you to rank in the 80's. For unions in that range, you'll probably only see stun mode show up once, pretty late into the fight, and only if your union's pushing. Otherwise, on non-push days, you probably won't see stun mode.

For expert... how long does the normal mode last? Cause the wiki lists 6 million for raging, but doesn't say for normal. Conversely, I see lv 30 as the minimum for ult to see rage, implying a 10 million HP normal mode, but no numbers for raging.
Anyway, 6 million HP for raging means that a single rage bar lasts 40 levels on its own (as expert's HP is 500k base + 150k per level). So the duration before each instance of stun mode is (however many levels worth of HP normal mode is) + ~40 levels worth of HP for raging. Stun mode would just show up far less frequently compared to the seven sins' "all the damn time".

For rage punishing stuff? *shrug* For them, the times where they're applicable get smushed together from small frequent slices into big chunks like in most non-UE content. And they're still relevant outside of UE, so they're not worried.

I apologize since I'm still a bit of a newb, but what exactly is a stun punisher type of team? Are there specific skills that you would normally use to take advantage of the easy push to stun from normal union events?


Dejnov.

Originally Posted by Dejnov

I apologize since I'm still a bit of a newb, but what exactly is a stun punisher type of team? Are there specific skills that you would normally use to take advantage of the easy push to stun from normal union events?

"Stun punishers" are Hime that have a skill that makes them do stupid amounts of damage when an enemy is under Stun status. Examples of this are Soul Siegfried, SSR Tyr and SR Oceanus.

The problem with Stun punishers are:
1. In most content, by the time you reach Stun, the fight is already over. So what's the point?
2. Even if the fight isn't over yet, this is the phase in the fight where the boss usually is of no threat to you. Why do you want to end this phase early? And not ending it early risks missing out on the huge damage bonus that Stun punishers get.

For this reason, Awakened Tyr is getting reworked into being able to "punish" at any time and not just at Stun. Oceanus, Siegfried and others won't be reworked and will forever be garbage.

Siegfried herself wont get a rework, but her Relics will.

Her Assault Relic will let her Raging Nuke proc twice.
Her Defender Hammer gives her Rage Mode-Buff an additional damage buff (30% Normal Atk, 20% Burst) for 2 turns. RIght now I dont know if it counts for all Modes or if it is specifically for Raging. Nevertheless, it helps Dark building a Hammer Grid for example.

People also use Sieg-Based Teams to OTK (One turn kill) Cata Ultimates (mainly Nuke Heavy Teams to put it into Raging and then into Stun). Biggest usage is during the 1-Turn-Dummy Event where Water has proven to be the Element of doing the highest amount of damage possible thanks to Stun-Punisher and heavy buff stacker.
They are niche, yes, but after a certain point of power they become a viable option - and are far from garbage.